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It has becoming very hard to enjoy the boss hunting side of the game due to the eggregious use of alts to camp Boss spawn spots. I know is hard enforce a no-camping rule, but I strongly believe that people doing so are killing the game by removing the fun that many take from actively trying to hunt down bosses. Though this use of alt in this is not in itself against CoC, it is so balatently against the spirit if the game that I would like propose some changes, in not to stop, make this behaviour far less worthwile. I suggest an increase in spawn spots for Boss's in each region. I could also be fun if they can pop in another region of the same land. For example, though nomally spawning in GoC, Ragukin could spawn in HH. I would also suggest that there is a random timer for the length of time that a toon can spent in the water wthout drowning. These are just some suggestions; I want to start a discussion of how as a community we can improve gameplay and where all can have a chance of find a Boss.

+1, camping bosses might not be against rules but still is against the spirit of the game (I say name and shame them in uni and such if you see it happen)

Problem is what can be done against it? Homins do have the right to be slacking somewhere looking at the sights and so on, and if their favorite spot happens to be at a boss spawn then so be it.
The only option I see is everyone doing the same make some f2p alts (eveyone is allowed 4 chars on 1 IP) and just put big piles of f2p next to those that are camping now then there is no advantage anymore for the campers. As long that not every angry boss hunter does it nothing will change but once the CSR's in this game start to see 10+ alts all looking at one boss spawn then they might take some action like they did with ppl using 8toons at a time to play in the past.

+1 for Spettra - I really dislike it when homins run their game like a factory and I very much respect the guiilds who still have a good look around for bosses - Just Us I think being one of them - maybe a "name and praise" in uni as well (mention Just Us being as they are Karavan and therefore baddies)

The problem is deeper. I, as a player, don't care if a boss is killed because a) an alt "found" it or b) a player found it. I see Nuno running all day through regions, I know of lots of people whose job is to check for bosses; hell, I do it too often enough. And once a boss is found it goes down in under 10 minutes if any remotely competent people show up.

This can't scale, imagine the server had *merely* tenfold of the current player base, 1000 people out of which a good chunk check bosses. Yep, same result, 90% of the people will never see any boss whatsoever for months.

Most other games solve this with instancing and dungeons. Assuming camping alts are somehow nerfed, the fact remains that bosses are still way too precious to not care about. So we'll just see more people roaming regions, searching for them.

Just my 2c.

+1 Spettra

Not gonna go into too much detail as its comments are purely from my perspective.

For me it does matter who found the boss, yes increased population means more ppl running around and searching but that is part of the game play or should be. If i see a boss or not its the possibility of finding one that counts. As it currently stands why even bother with Loria, 1/2 the game population or alts at least are camping it tucked safely away destroying what I and many enjoy about the game.

The only solution I can think of but which alas will undoubtedly never come to light is a totally random spawn location, I would prefer the same region it makes more sense to me. Timing issues would help but if you do not know where a boss will spawn how could you camp it.

MJ i think you have completely missed the point of Spettra's post. She is not whining about not seeing/killing a boss, but is saddened by the mentality of those who prize mats over the fun of hunting and killing a boss and instead camp alts for bosses. She wants to encourage people actually playing the game by going out and hunting for bosses irespective of whether you get one or not.

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I have always hated boss hunting and it's actually part of the reason I stayed out of large guilds after leaving the Divine Council of Pyr so many years ago. So, cries of "RUINING THE GAME!" are all a matter of perspective.

On the other hand, I know of at least one homin that never used alts and always killed nearly every boss when it popped using two very simple tools: Google Docs and a spreadsheet. Bosses spawn on a timer and in a limited number of locations. Using the shared spreadsheet, every member of the guild knew approximately when each boss would spawn. When a boss was due to spawn, the guild would start scouting the spawn locations and within moments of spawning, the boss would be down again. If the guild ever missed a boss, they would simply keep an eye out for it and it would soon be back in their rotation.

As illustrated above, alts are not the problem. Alts, in this case, are merely a symptom of the problem. The root of the problem is, quite simply, that bosses are predictable. Until spawn times and locations are randomized, spreadsheets and alts will "RUIN THE GAME!" for some.

Once spawn times and locations are randomized, then the diligent scouts will find the bosses first and others will raise the hue and cry, "THEY ARE RUINING THE GAME!" because then only large guilds with homins willing to scout regularly will soon discover that an entire region can be covered very quickly using a good targeting macro.

As far as randomizing goes, I would recommend randomizing times from 30 minutes to 2 days with a 1/100th chance of a 1 week absence. As for randomizing locations, the wider the spread, the better. I would recommend that anywhere the species can be found is a valid spawn region or, at the very least, anywhere in the continent where the critter is from. Make boss hunts a true challenge.

*deleted screenshot* GM Tiximei

I'm guessing that there is a language issue at hand but accusing me of lying in my forum post, "u probly are 1 that do alt camping and crying, right?" when you don't even know me is a sure way to end up on my ignore list and screenshots published to the forum.

What I wrote is exactly true.

Alts are only the CURRENT way of gaming bosses. My friend did it for two years using Google Docs and spreadsheets before that. He found it much more efficient than alts and he tried both.

Personally, unless the nanotech aspect of the forbidden history is fully embraced, then bosses are actually RP story breaking and should be removed from the game—in my opinion. That, however, is an entirely different story though.

Alts arent only the current way of gaming boss and if u dont like hunt must be so for all? Seems that you are very interested in the question to be one that hates bosses.

i've got but one thing to say about the camping and massive numbers of alts, it is a surprise to me that players from the past, like yakapo and firstdo paid for a full team of alts ($90.00 a month each, a large source of income for a game that needs all it can get) and for years and years it was ok. then the server merger happened, and we're all slammed together on a single server, and suddenly that practice they paid to use, was suddenly against the rules, further more, i find it even more amazing that while firstdo and yakapo can't do it anymore due to rules and complaints about them having an advantage, i still see players doing it now, i've personally seen a player with 7 toons running at one time, how did they beat the 4 accounts per ip limit?

i feel that this "rule" was made to punish some but not others, and while i don't know of yakapo or firstdo ever camping a boss with their alt's, they were disliked because they didn't have to wait for a team to show up, with the low server population it's only logical to me that a player would have to be his own friends to really do well.

i don't complain that they had them, i could never hope to a) afford that many paid accounts for so many years, and b) run them all at one time with any good results. they are players above their peer's because they can do something we can't, does that make it wrong? i don't know, nor do i care really, just a point of fact that they never used their alt's to camp a boss spawn, they just used them to kill a boss they found. so i can have 30 accounts online at a time if i'm not using them to do anything more then camp i guess.

sorry little off topic there while still being on topic.

as for a fix, i've said many more boss spawns would be nice, also a random timer for bosses (not named) would be nice, as it is now, there are groups of players that know the exact time a boss will spawn, and even the exact location of that spawn point, this needs to be changed, more random time (between 24 and 70 hours would really do fine, large margin which would not likely show a pattern) and more spawn points, the few spawn's we have now are easy to camp, and are rather easy to find once you mark the location, because they are "static" they don't move, because they're predictable some players will never see them because the really old players already have it down to a system they can use that new players will never be able to lean because it's so predictable.

the first 4 months i was on the ML i never saw a boss, but i was looking for them every day for hours, with no luck, it wasn't until player with many years of hunting invited me to go with them, that i found a boss, now after a few years of playing, i too can find bosses from time to time, but still find that some are more elusive then others, mainly due to camping and the predictability of the bosses respawn time and the fact that some have it down to a science.

@Gorran: Well, the bosses spawn 3 days *after they're killed*, so the spreadsheet method you describe is not exactly helpful - player still has to be in region to check for the boss, since you don't know the time of last killing. Whereas having an alt safely in the water enables you to keep checking without constantly porting and spending money and interrupting other activities. So in that regard, Spettra is right: if there's a way to eliminate camping alts, it evens the playing field for everyone.

Anyway, since I already said my opinion that you can't fix bosses without instancing .. getting out :)

Yes, well aware of the time frame. And if you kill the boss, you know exactly when the next respawn will be within a very short time frame. That was how Yakapo and his guild (live and not) killed every boss on Arispotle for so long. Date and time were logged for each boss kill. Bosses were also killed immediately after each server reset, as well as digging the sup nodes—server resets caused all bosses to spawn and current sup nodes to refill. Don't know if that is still true.

The spreadsheet method was a "problem".
The ALT method is a "problem".

I am not denying either exists (well, I don't know anyone using the spreadsheet method now). I am simply saying that both problems are only SYMPTOMS of the real problem, which is that there are limited spawn sites and timers.

As for my interest in the question, I love Ryzom. Anything I can contribute to help make it better, I will. I think randomizing the boss spawns and times will improve the game; so, I am all for it. The irony is, you seem to think I am your enemy Spettra. I am not. I fully agree that a change is needed and yet you started harassing me via tell.

I know for a fact that Yaka paid not only for his band of merry homins ($953.64 a year) but he has also paid for a number of other players' accounts for them over the years. He's exceptionally smart and very kind, I'm glad he's in my department at work. Also, he'll kill me when/if he reads this for telling the truth about him. :)

This I do disagree with. Swimming in Aeden Aqueous is already a pain without a random timer drowning you.