English

+1 Zagh

Joke or not, this would be an idea except for one major barrier: all the guides to learning the in game languages and their various rules are all in French. If you google translate the pages, it creates potential errors and discrepencies when trying to learn them, since google translate isn't as good as an actual person taking the time to translate the pages.

Ok...
As a french speaking english most of the time in my life, I feel offended.
I've assisted to many event, where 90% of french RP players were writing in english, because of a minority of non french speakers, who were barely participating in the RP.
What so ever, should I be angry after those players to be here? Should I be sorry to be french, to understand it and to speak it?

Now if your purpose is to raise people against each other...

Polyglot, sicut et ego non curo.

A lot of us non-Francophones have felt like second-class citizens for much of our time on Atys and that isn't right. It may not be fair that many of us only speak one language, but when you consider that the one language we do speak is the international lingua franca, I don't think it entirely unreasonable to ask those who speak a regional language to communicate (if able) in a language that most nations teach in primary school. It's certainly more reasonable than asking the majority of the population of Atys to learn another language well after we've hit adulthood and lost the brain plasticity to learn languages nearly as quickly as a small child simply because some proud people cannot be bothered to speak a non-native language they already know. Sure, it's still unfair to the relative minority who didn't learn English as a child, but this isn't a perfect universe.

I would feel differently if not for the fact that English is the closest thing we have to a universal language. But there is no changing the fact that the vast majority of us here are English-speakers, even if English is not our primary/native tongue, or that EU players are far more likely to be polyglots who are fully capable of meeting English-speaking monoglots halfway if they want to. I feel that those who are monoglots in a lingua franca are far more deserving of accomodation than those who are merely nationalistic.

I'm amazed how many french speaking people are eagerly proving the point. Keep it up.

I have been following this discussion for a while but i can't even properly follow this discussion anymore with everyone throwing in non-english, how in the world am i supposed to engage in a peaceful discussion this way. alot of the other languages aren't even being translated by the forum features.

can we atleast stick to english on the english forums? (Forums » GENERAL » English » FR language)

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Ne vous faites pas avoir ......

...... diviser pour mieux régner.


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Do not get fooled .........

......... divide and rule .

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I wish I were, but I grew up near Quebec so I'm used to it. And it saddens me because there are many decent Francophones (especially those who don't know English)  that are getting an undeserved bad rep as a result of the actions of a relative minority.

Yesterday i went to Brussels. For those who do not know, there are 3 official languages in Belgium, dutch, french and german. And then there are the local dialects...

I was a bit hungry and decided to get something to eat. While waiting for the order i heard following languages from other customers: english, portugese and some language i place within the baltic region ( not sure though ). I had to place my order in french or english, the owner didn't speak dutch. I guess i could have placed the order in vietnamese, but i don't speak that language very well :)

Later on, after my meal ( wich was delicious, but this isn't important in this discussion ), i walked towards a conserthall, wich was my destination for the whole trip. While doing so someone asked me some directions in german. I replied in dutch and then went on in french and finaly in english.

I proceeded and finaly reached my destination. There i bought something to drink, ordered in dutch and the bartender replied in french..

Is this important? Did i ever feel enraged because nobody spoke proper dutch in our capital? 60% of the Belgian population speaks dutch, around 35 % speaks french. You would presume because dutch is the dominant language in my country, everyone would reply in dutch, right? I meen, it's not only the capital of Belgium, but it's also the capital of the flemish region, where the official language is dutch.

Well very wrong, because it's Brussels. This all has to do with the specific situation of this city. I could go on just why english and french are the dominant languages in this city and why this city is different from the rest of the country, but that's beside the topic.

In the time i was still a student i went to Brussels. First thing i learned when i wanted to get a conversation going was: be flexible.

I asked things in dutch and got an answer in french, nice, we exchange information.
If the person you are talking to doesn't understand you because he only speaks french, switch to french, knowing you will make horrible linguistic mistakes..., but hey we are exchanging information again, very nice...

Is there still a problem, switch to english, sign language, throw in some spanish... Again, both parties are having a conversation wich is nice, but not in ideal conditions.


I know that in gaming the dominant language is english ( like dutch is in Belgium ), but there will be some exceptions. Ryzom is a example of such an exception.

It takes some effort from both sides to communicate, but it is possible. Players just need to be willing to switch out of their comfortzone. There are some individual players who will not or just simply can not do that. On the other hand i do see some effort from other players to translate or speak an non native language.

Maybe it's because i got used to this way of communicating that it doesn't bother me at all, i just know if one wants to communicate, it IS possible. Ranting about it doesn't let you communicate, en contraire, accepting this linguistic reality does. Accusing a whole linguistic community of not willing to communicate in a certain language doesn't help either.

I've been playing this game for a while and i never had any problem at all to communicate, even though i met players from around the globe. Sometimes it was easy and in a few occasions it was hard, but most of the times it was doable.

Though i do see this complaint as a sign that some players feel lost in french, so maybe this frustration needs to be adressed?

Anyway, my last words on this is : be a bit more belgian in this topic and all will work out fine :).
And all of this is possible in a country wich has been called " a hellhole" before :))

Bluaarbthi, servant of the Goo

EN:
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I played this game about 5 years ago, and have now been playing again for about a month. I don't remember any time in the past, and have yet to experience it recently - where I was not able to just ask someone something in English if I was not able to understand. I also never had anyone be mean to me because I couldn't understand.
I have a neurological disorder that may make learning languages and instruments nearly impossible for me, but I can use google translate as best I can.
There is no reason I can find to get someone's feathers all ruffled up over what language someone speaks, unless they are being rude or intentionally inflamatory towards you. Granted I've never made it past lv100 yet in the game, which I'm looking forward to this time around - so I've probably not seen the 'horrible mix' of things.
But all the wonderful Trek Tuesdays I went on, crafting sessions, it just never ended on people's generosity and there had to be at least 3 languages being spoken at any given time throughout the hours we were trekking and hanging out before and after.
I grew up in friggin' Missouri - center of the USA. People would consider me a "Redneck" or something. I don't get it. All the 'civilized' people are the stuck up bastards that can't raise a finger to enjoy each other. That goes for both sides too. I've been to Canada and met some great people, and some real jerks who made fun of me for being unable to speak French. On the flip-side, it bugs me to no end that as someone who can only speak english, but is happy to do my best with a translator and would give anything to be able to learn other languages, that there are people who just refuse to mingle because of some superiority complex.
All sides need to take a chill pill and come down from their godly platforms. Join the rest of us mere mortals before your pedestals collapse from the weight of your heads.
Ok, I think I've ostracized myself enough. lol - sorry for the flare up. My 2 cents.


FR (Google Translate):
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J'ai joué à ce jeu il y a environ 5 ans et je joue maintenant depuis environ un mois. Je ne me souviens de rien dans le passé, et je n'ai pas encore vécu cela récemment - où je n'ai pas été capable de demander à quelqu'un quelque chose en anglais si je n'étais pas capable de comprendre. Je n'ai jamais non plus été méchant avec moi parce que je ne pouvais pas comprendre.
J'ai un trouble neurologique qui peut rendre l'apprentissage des langues et des instruments presque impossible pour moi, mais je peux utiliser google translate du mieux que je peux.
Il n'y a pas de raison que je puisse trouver pour que les plumes de quelqu'un soient ébouriffées au sujet de la langue que quelqu'un parle, à moins qu'elles ne soient grossières ou délibérément infamantes envers vous. Certes, je n'ai jamais dépassé le niveau 100 dans le jeu, ce que j'attends avec impatience cette fois-ci - donc je n'ai probablement pas vu le 'mélange horrible' de choses.
Mais tous les merveilleux mardis de Trek auxquels je participais, des sessions d'artisanat, ça ne s'arrêtait jamais à la générosité des gens et il devait y avoir au moins 3 langues parlées à tout moment pendant les heures de trekking et de traîner avant et après.
J'ai grandi à Friggin 'Missouri - centre des États-Unis. Les gens me considèrent comme un "Redneck" ou quelque chose. Je ne comprends pas. Toutes les personnes «civilisées» sont des bâtards qui ne peuvent pas lever le petit doigt pour s'amuser. Cela vaut pour les deux parties aussi. Je suis allé au Canada et j'ai rencontré des gens formidables, et de vrais crétins qui se moquaient de moi pour ne pas pouvoir parler français. D'un autre côté, cela ne me dérange pas que quelqu'un qui ne parle que l'anglais, mais qui est heureux de faire de son mieux avec un traducteur et qui donnerait n'importe quoi pour apprendre d'autres langues, qu'il y a des gens qui refusent se mêler à cause d'un complexe de supériorité.
Tous les côtés doivent prendre une pilule de refroidissement et descendre de leurs plates-formes divines. Joignez-vous au reste de nous simples mortels avant que vos piédestaux s'effondre du poids de vos têtes.
Ok, Je pense que je me suis assez ostracisé. lol - désolé pour la poussée. Mes 2 cents.

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Take care all, and see you in game! :)
Prenez soin de tous, et à bientôt dans le jeu! :)
Zorg goed voor alles en zie je in het spel! :)
Pass auf dich auf und wir sehen uns im Spiel! :)
Beregi sebya, i uvidish'sya v igre! :)

I don't think it came across clear enough, so I'll take the burden of repetition without actually screening through the whole of the thread to search for the fitting citations. Screen for yourself and you'll find everything over the course of the few previous pages we had.

I will make this as short as I can and very concisely now.
This is not aimed at the following people:
- those who do not speak English
- those who struggle to speak English, yet are eager to perform better
- those who make efforts in translating French to whatever language and back

This, however, is aimed at:
- those who could write in eloquent English yet chose to not do so
- those who can't be bothered in the slightest to to learn a word or two of English

Here are some statements for elaboration:
- This accounts for players of all languages but is in its majority aimed at those French players doing it. Because from what I was able to observe and gather information on, they're the main offenders.
- As others have stated in previous posts, this has and does push players away as they do feel treated second classed.
- Being told that "this is a french game" makes people want to hurt your face pretty hard.

To summarize:
If you are capable of expressing yourself in English, for the love of all what's holy, unholy, all gods and goddesses, mother Earth and the skies, ... write in English.