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#246 Added by Elvanae 4 years ago [en]

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Crailus

To turn around and change the rules again after all of the work put into developing characters to play within the rules because the French are complaining is the issue. As Beef stated earlier in the thread, we have talked it over and are fine with whatever the devs decide on. Our faction losing 4 toons total is not going to turn the tides of war. But the bias has and continues to be on display from those making these decisions.

Its not just the French who have issues with multiboxing. I understood from the RF meeting that the devs were concerned about the addition of new content in game that could be executed by a single player and their 3 alts.

However, putting aside the impact of multiboxing on PvE elements of the game, this disucssion has undoubtedly focused heavily on the PvP aspects of the game.

Crailus you state that you don't believe losing 4 alt toons will change anything. I myself noted a number of players who had 3 toons on follow from the Kara faction at the last OP. IF losing these toons is not in your opinion going to result in a difference then why bring them?

In any case I strongly believe that the number of toons that appeared to be used as alts in use at that last OP was a lot more than 4.

I can appreciate that an alt cp can be very helpful, however, I really want to understand from those players who bring 2+ alts to OP battles why you do this? Why did you decided to bring not just 1, maybe not just 2 but 3 to the last OP battle at Gu-Quin?

Personally I believe it gives you an advantage to do so - you can so you do it - you don't care it gives you an advantage.

I also dont buy some of the justifications I have heard on this thread (about PvP elements) including that it is a challenege and even some arguing that alts dont give you an advantage at all. It certainly gave you an advantage last OP, so much so that one of your faction put it like this:

On a last point regarding the time and effort that people spend leveling their alts and how all this will go to waste, its funny that quite a lot of the "alts" are old players who clearly do not play any longer.

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#247 Added by Yaandor 4 years ago [en]

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**DEL** Irrelevant - Non pertinent

Last edited by Heli (4 years ago)

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Yaandor | Cult of Dgambi | He who walks alone
Atys is a stern and determined teacher; willing to repeat the same lesson as often as necessary.

#248 Added by Beeficus 4 years ago [en]

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I am the multiboxing worst case scenario!

Is there a title for that? :D

In all seriousness, if I can do this in war without getting my collective butts handed to me you are all so scroooooood.

Edited 2 times | Last edited by Beeficus (4 years ago)

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#249 Added by Nitrouss 4 years ago [en]

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Beeficus

I am the multiboxing worst case scenario!

Is there a title for that? :D

In all seriousness, if I can do this in war without getting my collective butts handed to me you are all so scroooooood.

give him the title of noobie!!!! :D
yeah noobie that will work, just focus madness your 4 toons so you wipe your own side out xD

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#250 Added by Fleetwood 4 years ago [en]

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Adding my voice to those who have argued that a two-toon limit has no rational justification. One and many are rational options, but two is just arbitrary.

My preference is for a one-toon limit, and this is why:
The reason I play an MMO rather than a single-player game is that I want to play with other people. I want it to be a social experience. But if everyone else is playing with their own alts, they have no need to play with me.

#251 Added by Nitrouss 4 years ago [en]

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Fleetwood

Adding my voice to those who have argued that a two-toon limit has no rational justification. One and many are rational options, but two is just arbitrary.

My preference is for a one-toon limit, and this is why:
The reason I play an MMO rather than a single-player game is that I want to play with other people. I want it to be a social experience. But if everyone else is playing with their own alts, they have no need to play with me.

your argument would be vaid if the game had a massive population... mmorpg stand for....massive multiplayer online roleplaying game. ryzom has maybe 200 players at max, different factions, time zones and languages.. most times its hard to even find a team.

Last edited by Nitrouss (4 years ago)

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#252 Added by Fleetwood 4 years ago [en]

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Nitrouss

your argument would be vaid if the game had a massive population... mmorpg stand for....massive multiplayer online roleplaying game. ryzom has maybe 200 players at max, different factions, time zones and languages.. most times its hard to even find a team.

I draw the opposite conclusion from the same facts. The fewer people there are online, the more imperative it is that they play together rather than alone.

Last edited by Fleetwood (4 years ago)

#253 Added by Jorgensen 4 years ago [en]

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i consider this an MMO in the sense of Minimally Multiplayer .. especially in my timezone. I use one unsubbed second account and that lets me level and dig at a reasonable rate. Searching around every day for someone at the right level to train with is unrealistic. I agree with fleetwood that the game *should* be about cooperating to achieve stuff, but I also agree with nitrouss that it is too small and the current population too unfriendly to insist that people don't use alts

#254 Added by Heernis 4 years ago Multilingual

Multilingual | [Deutsch] | English

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Jetzt überlegt mal. Wenn ich das ganze Thema mal herunter breche auf ein ganz naives Brettspiel. Sagen wir: "Mensch Ärger dich nicht". Dieses Spiel ist von vorn herein dafür gedacht ein Gesellschaftsspiel zu sein mit 4 Spielern. Es gibt 4 Plätze, die besetzt werden können. Alle sind gleich und haben die gleichen Voraussetzungen. Die Würfel bestimmen über den Verlauf des Spiels.

Jetzt kommen die Multiboxer!

Falls 2 Spieler spielen und jeder jeweils 2 Figuren lenken, dann haben sie gleiche Voraussetzungen.

Wenn jetzt aber einer 3 Plätze besetzt und der andere nur einen, dann verdreifacht sich die Wahrscheinlichkeit, das der Multiboxer gewinnt.

So einfach oder?

Warum sollte man überhaupt mehrere Slots als Multiboxer besetzen, wenn genug Leute da sind?

Sozialer Aspekt: Es gibt nicht genug Spieler (was meist nicht der Fall ist), oder nicht genug, die mit dir spielen wollen (bedeutet, es gibt nicht genug die dich oder du sie mögen), oder du bist einfach so asozial, dass man dich lieber meidet.

Herausforderung: Da dir das Spiel viel zu einfach ist, da man nur würfelt und Figuren bewegst, siehst du es als Herausforderung mehrere Figuren zu lenken, damit es für dich spannender und anstrengender wird. Aber du vergisst, dass dieses Spiel Gesellschaft viel mehr Spaß macht und es dafür gedacht ist.

Kunst: Es wahrlich eine Kunst "Mensch Ärger dich nicht" alleine zu spielen, aber auch genauso traurig. Man hat eher Mitleid mit den Multiboxern und würdest gerne mit ihnen als einen Spieler spielen, aber dann sind da, noch die anderen. Es ist kein Platz mehr auf dem Spielbrett frei. Man macht zwar ein Platz frei und alle können glücklich sein, aber es fühlt sich eher so an, als wäre man das fünfte Rad am Wagen: "Oh da ist ja noch der andere... Er kann doch mit sich selbst spielen... Warum sollte ich bleiben?" Es wird das Gefühl im Spiel vermittelt, dass man als einzelner Homin unwichtig ist und ein Multiboxer mich sowieso nicht braucht, um zu spielen. Ich geh mal besser. Man kann so spielen, aber da bleibt immer dieser leicht bittere Geschmack, wenn man dann einen Multiboxer sieht. Man meidet ihn einfach.

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#255 Added by Sinvaders 4 years ago [en]

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Jorgensen

and dig at a reasonable rate

You do NOT need a second toon to dig at a "reasonable rate" specially if you use it for healing your sources.
This is just convenience and "laziness" (notice the ") in the sense that stability stats of sources become useless, so if eveyrone is doing that why do we keep this stats?

#256 Added by Moniq 4 years ago [en]

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Jorgensen

...Searching around every day for someone at the right level to train with is unrealistic...

In RP it sounds way more realistic than an alt dummy :)

#257 Added by Sinvaders 4 years ago [fr]

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Yes, in "RP" it doesn't make any sense. But you also need to keep in mind the gameplay point of view and the fact that some people have only little time to spend on the game (when you 4h available in a week for the game you do not want to spend half of this time by searching a team).

#258 Added by Jorgensen 4 years ago [en]

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Last edited by Jorgensen (4 years ago)

#259 Added by Elvanae 4 years ago [en]

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Beeficus

I am the multiboxing worst case scenario!

Is there a title for that? :D

In all seriousness, if I can do this in war without getting my collective butts handed to me you are all so scroooooood.

What happened to your live streams? I bet you the 5 dappers Ati tried to give me the other day that a lot of people will be interested to see your live streaming the battles this evening and tomorrow.

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#260 Added by Fleetwood 4 years ago [en]

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Jorgensen

I agree with fleetwood that the game *should* be about cooperating to achieve stuff, but I also agree with nitrouss that it is too small and the current population too unfriendly to insist that people don't use alts

Perhaps the current population is unfriendly only because they can afford to be - they don't need to be cooperative towards other players as they have their alts to play with.

One of my professors used the following analogy: suppose you are going to watch a football match, where you will stand in a crowd on an embankment. If you take an apple-box with you, and stand on it, you will get a better view. But if everyone takes an apple-box, no-one will get a better view, and everyone will have to lug an apple-box around. Everyone would be better off if everyone stopped taking an apple-box, but no-one can afford to be the first to stop, as then they will get no view at all. The only solution is to ban apple-boxes from football venues. When considering the merits of such a rule, you must consider not only the cost to you of your not having an apple-box, but also the benefit to you of everyone else not having one either.

Last edited by Fleetwood (4 years ago)

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