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#241 Added by Nitrouss 4 years ago [en]

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please don't remove this link and say its irrelevant

Control of multiple characters in OP Battles.

this topic was dealt with previously by the community manager and CSR, people using multiple toon's was at the heart of the problem, the answer as to how players are so coordinated is within that thread.

Edited 3 times | Last edited by Nitrouss (4 years ago)

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#242 Added by Yaandor 4 years ago [en]

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Heh, went and read a bit of the thread that Nitrouss referenced.

Thought it was kind of funny that Beeficus was one of the complainers and for this current thread he was the target of accusations.

And the wheel keeps turning...

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Atys is a stern and determined teacher; willing to repeat the same lesson as often as necessary.

#243 Added by Crailus 4 years ago [en]

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Yes, we went through this all before on Arispotle. The CSRs/Devs refused to do anything about the botters, and in response we leveled our own alts to try to even the playing field. It wasn't until the alts affected non-English speaking players that anything was done upon the merging of the servers (at first, being told controlling any more than 1 toon was a bannable offense which was a hilarious twist, then the 4 account limit was settled on.) To turn around and change the rules again after all of the work put into developing characters to play within the rules because the French are complaining is the issue. As Beef stated earlier in the thread, we have talked it over and are fine with whatever the devs decide on. Our faction losing 4 toons total is not going to turn the tides of war. But the bias has and continues to be on display from those making these decisions.

Last edited by Tamarea (4 years ago) | Reason: Fixed the language flag to allow translations.

#244 Added by Crailus 4 years ago [fr]

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deleted

Last edited by Crailus (4 years ago)

#245 Added by Bucshotz 4 years ago [en]

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Haven't commented on this because to be completely honest I hardly care. I like to dig with 4 toons. 2 dig masters, 2 cp. PvP on the other hand, is much more fun for me with 1 toon. Here's my opinion.

What I'd like to see is op wars where it's players vs players. Not 30 players vs 30 players + 30 alts (or more).

Really don't care what people do in pve, or even open world pvp. But alts should be banned from ops at the very least.

For those who say it doesn't create an advantage.. you have 4 toons healing or 4 toons nuking at one time. Even to coordinate 4 players to have a targetted nuke would be very hard to sync like these players with their alts do at ops, and one shotting someone on the opposite side who cannot damage you because he is a single toon and you have 3 toons healing your main is not fair nor balanced one bit.

With that being said, I even took an alt to this last OP war, and sure I had a blast, but it was very difficult for anyone to kill me cuz i could easily alt tab and heal myself. Doesn't make for really balanced pvp dynamics.

My vote is, ban alts for OP wars, let people use them outside of OP wars.

OR

Set a cap to amount of toons per op battle. Say, 30 toons max for example, then whether they are alts or not wouldn't matter.

Edited 3 times | Last edited by Bucshotz (4 years ago)

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#246 Added by Elvanae 4 years ago [en]

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Crailus

To turn around and change the rules again after all of the work put into developing characters to play within the rules because the French are complaining is the issue. As Beef stated earlier in the thread, we have talked it over and are fine with whatever the devs decide on. Our faction losing 4 toons total is not going to turn the tides of war. But the bias has and continues to be on display from those making these decisions.

Its not just the French who have issues with multiboxing. I understood from the RF meeting that the devs were concerned about the addition of new content in game that could be executed by a single player and their 3 alts.

However, putting aside the impact of multiboxing on PvE elements of the game, this disucssion has undoubtedly focused heavily on the PvP aspects of the game.

Crailus you state that you don't believe losing 4 alt toons will change anything. I myself noted a number of players who had 3 toons on follow from the Kara faction at the last OP. IF losing these toons is not in your opinion going to result in a difference then why bring them?

In any case I strongly believe that the number of toons that appeared to be used as alts in use at that last OP was a lot more than 4.

I can appreciate that an alt cp can be very helpful, however, I really want to understand from those players who bring 2+ alts to OP battles why you do this? Why did you decided to bring not just 1, maybe not just 2 but 3 to the last OP battle at Gu-Quin?

Personally I believe it gives you an advantage to do so - you can so you do it - you don't care it gives you an advantage.

I also dont buy some of the justifications I have heard on this thread (about PvP elements) including that it is a challenege and even some arguing that alts dont give you an advantage at all. It certainly gave you an advantage last OP, so much so that one of your faction put it like this:

On a last point regarding the time and effort that people spend leveling their alts and how all this will go to waste, its funny that quite a lot of the "alts" are old players who clearly do not play any longer.

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#247 Added by Yaandor 4 years ago [en]

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**DEL** Irrelevant - Non pertinent

Last edited by Heli (4 years ago)

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Yaandor | Cult of Dgambi | He who walks alone
Atys is a stern and determined teacher; willing to repeat the same lesson as often as necessary.

#248 Added by Beeficus 4 years ago [en]

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I am the multiboxing worst case scenario!

Is there a title for that? :D

In all seriousness, if I can do this in war without getting my collective butts handed to me you are all so scroooooood.

Edited 2 times | Last edited by Beeficus (4 years ago)

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#249 Added by Nitrouss 4 years ago [en]

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Beeficus

I am the multiboxing worst case scenario!

Is there a title for that? :D

In all seriousness, if I can do this in war without getting my collective butts handed to me you are all so scroooooood.

give him the title of noobie!!!! :D
yeah noobie that will work, just focus madness your 4 toons so you wipe your own side out xD

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#250 Added by Fleetwood 4 years ago [en]

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Adding my voice to those who have argued that a two-toon limit has no rational justification. One and many are rational options, but two is just arbitrary.

My preference is for a one-toon limit, and this is why:
The reason I play an MMO rather than a single-player game is that I want to play with other people. I want it to be a social experience. But if everyone else is playing with their own alts, they have no need to play with me.

#251 Added by Nitrouss 4 years ago [en]

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Fleetwood

Adding my voice to those who have argued that a two-toon limit has no rational justification. One and many are rational options, but two is just arbitrary.

My preference is for a one-toon limit, and this is why:
The reason I play an MMO rather than a single-player game is that I want to play with other people. I want it to be a social experience. But if everyone else is playing with their own alts, they have no need to play with me.

your argument would be vaid if the game had a massive population... mmorpg stand for....massive multiplayer online roleplaying game. ryzom has maybe 200 players at max, different factions, time zones and languages.. most times its hard to even find a team.

Last edited by Nitrouss (4 years ago)

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#252 Added by Fleetwood 4 years ago [en]

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Nitrouss

your argument would be vaid if the game had a massive population... mmorpg stand for....massive multiplayer online roleplaying game. ryzom has maybe 200 players at max, different factions, time zones and languages.. most times its hard to even find a team.

I draw the opposite conclusion from the same facts. The fewer people there are online, the more imperative it is that they play together rather than alone.

Last edited by Fleetwood (4 years ago)

#253 Added by Jorgensen 4 years ago [en]

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i consider this an MMO in the sense of Minimally Multiplayer .. especially in my timezone. I use one unsubbed second account and that lets me level and dig at a reasonable rate. Searching around every day for someone at the right level to train with is unrealistic. I agree with fleetwood that the game *should* be about cooperating to achieve stuff, but I also agree with nitrouss that it is too small and the current population too unfriendly to insist that people don't use alts

#254 Added by Heernis 4 years ago Multilingual

Multilingual | [Deutsch] | English

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Jetzt überlegt mal. Wenn ich das ganze Thema mal herunter breche auf ein ganz naives Brettspiel. Sagen wir: "Mensch Ärger dich nicht". Dieses Spiel ist von vorn herein dafür gedacht ein Gesellschaftsspiel zu sein mit 4 Spielern. Es gibt 4 Plätze, die besetzt werden können. Alle sind gleich und haben die gleichen Voraussetzungen. Die Würfel bestimmen über den Verlauf des Spiels.

Jetzt kommen die Multiboxer!

Falls 2 Spieler spielen und jeder jeweils 2 Figuren lenken, dann haben sie gleiche Voraussetzungen.

Wenn jetzt aber einer 3 Plätze besetzt und der andere nur einen, dann verdreifacht sich die Wahrscheinlichkeit, das der Multiboxer gewinnt.

So einfach oder?

Warum sollte man überhaupt mehrere Slots als Multiboxer besetzen, wenn genug Leute da sind?

Sozialer Aspekt: Es gibt nicht genug Spieler (was meist nicht der Fall ist), oder nicht genug, die mit dir spielen wollen (bedeutet, es gibt nicht genug die dich oder du sie mögen), oder du bist einfach so asozial, dass man dich lieber meidet.

Herausforderung: Da dir das Spiel viel zu einfach ist, da man nur würfelt und Figuren bewegst, siehst du es als Herausforderung mehrere Figuren zu lenken, damit es für dich spannender und anstrengender wird. Aber du vergisst, dass dieses Spiel Gesellschaft viel mehr Spaß macht und es dafür gedacht ist.

Kunst: Es wahrlich eine Kunst "Mensch Ärger dich nicht" alleine zu spielen, aber auch genauso traurig. Man hat eher Mitleid mit den Multiboxern und würdest gerne mit ihnen als einen Spieler spielen, aber dann sind da, noch die anderen. Es ist kein Platz mehr auf dem Spielbrett frei. Man macht zwar ein Platz frei und alle können glücklich sein, aber es fühlt sich eher so an, als wäre man das fünfte Rad am Wagen: "Oh da ist ja noch der andere... Er kann doch mit sich selbst spielen... Warum sollte ich bleiben?" Es wird das Gefühl im Spiel vermittelt, dass man als einzelner Homin unwichtig ist und ein Multiboxer mich sowieso nicht braucht, um zu spielen. Ich geh mal besser. Man kann so spielen, aber da bleibt immer dieser leicht bittere Geschmack, wenn man dann einen Multiboxer sieht. Man meidet ihn einfach.

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#255 Added by Sinvaders 4 years ago [en]

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Jorgensen

and dig at a reasonable rate

You do NOT need a second toon to dig at a "reasonable rate" specially if you use it for healing your sources.
This is just convenience and "laziness" (notice the ") in the sense that stability stats of sources become useless, so if eveyrone is doing that why do we keep this stats?

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