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#1 Added by Arcueid 8 years ago Report | Quote[en] 

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News

I have added the possiblity for user editable post craft formulas to the current beta of kipee craft and made a switch from the ancient Delphi 7 to a more recent version, but still no cross platform support because Lazarus lacks 3rd party components needed by KipeeCraft. This beta might break something existing or crash, please report back with any problems you might have.

Feedback

Is there still a public interest to these formulas and the tinkering / testing involved with it?

Changes

I had to solve two problems to get it working:

1) I combined multiple plans into a single recipe e.g. Long Axe and Sword have exactly the same parts. This looked like a clever idea back in the day, but with postcraft stats it is a problem because sword and axe differ in some stats like attack speed even with the same mats used.
I solved this by adding an option to these combined plans to select the actual item like a sword. This way all recipes stay backwards compatible and can be read by older versions of KC aswell.

2) I wrote program code to calculate postcraft values for the individual attributes like:

case attridx of
    {magic values}
    CElementalCastSpeed, CElementalPower,
    COffensiveAfflictionCastSpeed, COffensiveAfflictionPower,
    CDefensiveAfflictionCastSpeed, CDefensiveAfflictionPower,
    CHealCastSpeed, CHealPower:
    begin
      poststat := 20 + prestat * 0.8;
    end;
end;

But this could only end up in a chaotic mess if done for all plans. Damage for example differs for each weapon and even depends on the item quality!
I solved this by adding a "config" file for each existing crafting plan in KipeeCraft. This file contains all formulas to calculate the postcraft values from the precraft values. It is a simple text file and will be automatically generated the first time it is accessed.
Storing these formulas in files similar to recipes has many advantages like opening several in an editor and copy & pasting formulas, one can also post them on the forum or send them via mail, back them up etc.

Support

And this is where I need your help. I don't have the time to add all these formulas myself, nor do I personally need them. Most seasoned crafters know how much precraft % is needed to get the result, I thought of these values just as a little "gimmick" when adding them ages ago...
I can include formula files with a future release of kipeecraft, you can add your name as comment inside the file or tell me how you want to be credited, if you decide to contribute to these formulas!

I will post a how-to next, aswell as access to the beta of KipeeCraft.

arc

Edited 5 times | Last edited by Arcueid (8 years ago)

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#2 Added by Arcueid 8 years ago Report | Quote[en] 

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Where to find the KipeeCraft Beta files?

You can find the latest beta of KipeeCraft here http://mollylovescake.de/kcbeta/

(Visit the KipeeCraft Homepage at http://mollylovescake.de/kipeecraft/ if you are new to this program to see what it's all about.)

Changelog: http://mollylovescake.de/kcbeta/changelog.txt

How to get started

1) Select the plan you want to edit the formulas for, if you have a combined plan make sure to select the correct option.


2) Open the Recipe menu, you will see a new option to edit the post craft data. This will create / open a file in the DATA\postcraft directory of KipeeCraft with the standard editor.


3) You can now add / edit the formulas. Make sure to save the file before testing the changes inside KipeeCraft. The accepted formula format is explained in every text file inside a comment.


4) Changes are applied whenever your recipe updates, you could just adjust the amount of a material or reload a recipe for testing with the browser (F4).


5) If you don't see the desired values, have a look at the System Info section of KipeeCraft for any error messages related to your formulas.


That's it!

Organizing

Please let others know, if you decide to work on one or more craft plans so the workload can be distributed. I'm also not sure how to distribute / exchange the files, feel free to have a discussion in this thread. Maybe a cloud service? A Wiki?

Feel free to contact me for any questions you might have or post them here.

arc

Edited 3 times | Last edited by Arcueid (8 years ago)

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#3 Added by Arfur 8 years ago Report | Quote[en] 

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"Feedback
Is there still a public interest to these formulas and the tinkering / testing involved with it?"

Yes there is. I would think that this is the single most useful utility outside the game.

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It's bad luck to be superstitious . . .



Palta e decata, nan nec ilne matala.

When one goes on a journey it is not the scenery that changes, but the traveller

#4 Added by Yubina 8 years ago Report | Quote[en] 

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Hello o/

I used some of the in game data I collected and published earlier this year (here http://app.ryzom.com/app_forum/index.php?page=topic/view/8922/56# 56) and tested with it.

My data is slightly inaccurate and in game rounding is just strange sometimes ^^, but in general this all seems to work fine. :)
Thank you Arc, it’s amazing :D





orange fields are used in the formulas

copy + paste formulas http://pastebin.com/7r5SuJ2x

#5 Added by Lopyrech 8 years ago Report | Quote[en] 

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The in game rounding is actually a cast from float to int, so all decimals are removed. For example, -1.1 and -1.9 are both 'rounded' to -1, and 2.1 and 2.9 are rounded to 2.
I'm not 100% sure about weight / protection factor, but I think it's the same, but truncated to 2 / 1 decimals.

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#6 Added by Yubina 8 years ago Report | Quote[en] 

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Lopyrech
The in game rounding is actually a cast from float to int, so all decimals are removed. For example, -1.1 and -1.9 are both 'rounded' to -1, and 2.1 and 2.9 are rounded to 2.
I'm not 100% sure about weight / protection factor, but I think it's the same, but truncated to 2 / 1 decimals.

Yes, thats right :)
(but I couldn't have it explained that well in English)

But sometimes there is something else, for example like:
1/3 = 0.3333 -> 0.3333 * 3 = 0.9999, but in game value is 1 instead of the expected 0
I consider this behavior is maybe even different depending on OS/compiler used

#7 Added by Arcueid 8 years ago Report | Quote[en] 

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Thank you for your work, Yubina! I believe most values are cut off ingame, like Lopyrech wrote. Even with access to the game code and original formulas, the results are sometimes off by +/- 1% in KipeeCraft. It might be a rounding / accuracy issue which leads to 41.9987 instead of 42.0 or similar and then getting cut off to 41 where it is supposed to be 42.

There have been "rounding" problems even within the client itself, the old 2.1 client displayed a 19 or so, while the current v3 client displays a 20 which was correct. I know to some people, esp when using rare npc armor plans and boss loot every single fraction of a percent counts. But I want to keep some secrets / challenges open, so I'm satisfied with KipeeCrafts accuracy as is.

KipeeCraft is a versatile tool but it was never meant to replace crafters and crafting. It should help those who know their art to work more efficient and explore the limits of possible recipes and on the other hand provide a starting point for players new to the ryzom crafting system, as it is pretty confusing for beginners.

arc

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#8 Added by Yubina 8 years ago Report | Quote[en] 

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What I tried to say before, from my impression, KC is actually often more accurate than in-game (not the other way) :)


I also wrote the formulas for Jewelry:



(made from ex dig mats only, btw)

http://pastebin.com/SpHWWzAs


And Amps:



http://pastebin.com/1FsNVJyt



And I like to share my favorite in-game math error.

Spoiler: (recipe included)

#9 Added by Arcueid 8 years ago Report | Quote[en] 

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Thank you for your hard work, Yubina! I have two of these "accidents" aswell, import-able in KipeeCraft by pressing F12 :) Mine are optimized for SAP Load and Durability, no Loot used. Enjoy!

arc

Recipe1:

zAF42l2QQU+DMBiG7yT8h3rTwwyFuZ16KAySxZjhXDy4mKbi
x2gsLSklQX+9BeYyPH5f3vd5+vW4VaV+9z3aNFIU3AqtyKNo
ABLDS+t7r2DaYZcbQPg+RLdhgFfBOlzdocUCxemB3vie7x33
ULiWA+XcWjBquyHLy7BrRm5wWbxYI9SJxLwVBXruuBT2Gz3x
k5to7R5SCjC+l+i6BmVJqlwHnacWVWBgkp5pztpKbTHBPRqR
TGkFbPPDNcvEh+uGUyIcEmlfgJSOxDJtoLVsx23FYm6+EJ5i
EcHBdS43ooa91rZlb51itB6Q0ZRdknAmpQoszK0PgzWptCjg
T0k/jQA5k65I1KNMOMTIycGU0v3RLLP+J4u7qwN97xerLJjf


Recipe2:

wAF42lWQMW/CMBCF90j5D+7WDlRxQmHykIQgoaoipVWHosoy
4UItHDu6GBT66+sAQnixdPc+v3d364WuzU8YpG2rZCWsNJq9
yhYgR1HbMPgC7IZeiUDoc0we44hOomk8eSKjEcmKz/QhDMJg
vYLK/XJGpbAWUC9mbHwrlu3ZN7o1PixKvWOZ6GRF3g9CSXsi
b2LnqrRxg9QSMAxy0zSgLcsRhIUt2ZxIcTTqOGgu8urlMjtl
LGW0J3OpgWvjnqWwvzwTuCf0ose+nkG1d6t5SMLie6QErJUb
02PGvk26RQnKI15Yck/M/oThc7kBJPEFmAwx59WvHhos+MiU
0agnRV+BUu4CvETZwMoY2/Hvg+ZpM7DJcIV/+8+USw==

Last edited by Arcueid (8 years ago)

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#10 Added by Lopyrech 8 years ago Report | Quote[en] 

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This is a pretty huge spoiler about how you can get a postcraft value based on a precraft value. Don't read it if you want to discover that by yourself !

Spoiler

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#11 Added by Yubina 8 years ago Report | Quote[en] 

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Wonderful recipes :)
Most of the recipes I create are more about simplicity than perfection, using very few mat types and mostly easy to acquire mats. Like:
Spoiler

@Lopyrech
wow :O

#12 Added by Nitrouss 8 years ago Report | Quote[en] 

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Arc .... you need to add sup 250ql yubo mats!! Baddie!!!

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Peace is a lie, there is only passion.
Through passion, you gain strength.
Through strength, you gain power.
Through power, you gain victory.
Through victory, your chains are broken.
Ma-Duk shall free you.

#13 Added by Arcueid 8 years ago Report | Quote[en] 

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@Lopyrech
Thank you for collecting and writing all of this! Irregular behaviour and bugs were some of the reasons why I haven't added those formulas or a way to edit them.


@Nitrouss
I did not include special materials such as event mats or generic mission reward mats in the database because they would be used with the various tools and produce recipes which can only be crafted in very limited amounts.

You can add any matrial you want with the CDS Edit tool, downloadable here http://www.mollylovescake.de/kipeecraft/download.html

You can also export the whole database to .csv files which can be edited in excel and after adding your materials import them back to .cds files for KipeeCraft.

I'm aware this is not the most comfortable way to add materials, but it is possible to edit any existing material in the database view by double clicking on any of the fields!

arc

Edited 4 times | Last edited by Arcueid (8 years ago)

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#14 Added by Lopyrech 8 years ago Report | Quote[en] 

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@Arcueid
There is no bug on the crafting part with speed, only with how the value is used in the actual speed calculation. Hopefully this will be solved soon :-)

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#15 Added by Yubina 8 years ago Report | Quote[en] 

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I studied Lopyrech's formulas and the links to the code.
I found only one error in my above posted formulas, thats the damage formula (for the 2h axe).

But I'm not exactly sure this 2nd try is all right now, so all without any warranty ;)

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1CZezurwiuOsReuBpDnnwxEgBA mEriflg8kEEoUoMLNw 
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