Discussing the Marauder Faction/Cult - IDEAS FOR RYZOM

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#58 Added by Salazar 9 years ago [en]

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Lacuna

@ Salazar and Daomei, I still argue that Mara are a nation. We will not be able to agree on this as we have different undertsandings of what this means. (...)

The mara are a people. The are not a mob. I think both of you do not really know much about tribal peoples or the history of ethnography of them. Your toons can see them as a ravening mob out to kill all hominkind. A view that mirrors the european curtural myths of the Other that we can trace back to Tacitus and Herodotus, indeed this is good rp. But this discussion is not about what toons think but what the mara actually are. We may not agree that they are a nation, but they are a people. And as cultrual entity that endure over time it is not unreasonable that as members of this culture that mara toons can show solidarity and earn faction points.

The term to describe Peoples usually their common language rather than their way of life - in many cases they were rather fighting each other than anything else. That was very much the case with the Germanic tribes, and it sort of went on into the 19th Century - there was no German nation until Bismarck forced it into being. The Arabic peoples are another example. The Atys countries are highly artificial in their unity, and the various cities given to the different language servers were just an effort to soothe the pain, to minimize the more or less natural problems. So I have high respect for those who choose to be Marauders and be forced in a community similar to Babel and the building of its tower, for few can (like Daomei) talk and write in several tongues, for the self-developed Marauder language is - like the language of the Atys nations - more of an abstract idea than of factual use.

But I do see a quite large gap between the Marauder players and the NPC Marauders who tried to take over the New Lands by force, are ruled by Old Lands' Melkiar, count blood-thirsty bandits and murderers and psychopaths like Aen and Dante and Marung amongst their representatives and deal in murder, drug trade and slavery. There's probably need to sort that out, as that very much infuences the dealings with the Marauders.

@Binarabi: As for slavery - don't forget that the last nation which introduced slaves were the Zorai under mad Fung-Tun. They are no writings telling us that Mabreka dropped it when he diposed of Fung-Tun. Probably it was continued until the ratification of the Homin Rights Act. ;)

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Salazar Caradini
Filira Matia
Royal Historian
Member of the Royal Academy of Yrkanis
First Seraph of the Order of the Argo Navis

#59 Added by Binarabi 9 years ago [en]

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Yes - I remembered that after I posted - we sort have more reasons to dislike Zorians - especially with their slow ponderous way of thinking as well as their nasty, mean attitude to Trykers :D

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Binarabi
This idea of "I'm offended". Well I've got news for you. I'm offended by a lot of things too. Where do I send my list? Life is offensive. You know what I mean? Just get in touch with your outer adult. (Bill Hicks)

#60 Added by Rikutatis 9 years ago [en]

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Salazar

But I do see a quite large gap between the Marauder players and the NPC Marauders who tried to take over the New Lands by force, are ruled by Old Lands' Melkiar, count blood-thirsty bandits and murderers and psychopaths like Aen and Dante and Marung amongst their representatives and deal in murder, drug trade and slavery. There's probably need to sort that out, as that very much infuences the dealings with the Marauders.

Agreed.

Salazar

@Binarabi: As for slavery - don't forget that the last nation which introduced slaves were the Zorai under mad Fung-Tun. They are no writings telling us that Mabreka dropped it when he diposed of Fung-Tun. Probably it was continued until the ratification of the Homin Rights Act. ;)

*hides his Tryker slave in the basement* o.O

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"We are Kami. We are here to be you. We are many as you are of many minds. We are one as you are one in Ma-Duk."

#61 Added by Daomei 9 years ago [en]

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Such "interracial" rants remind me the virtue marauders and rangers have in common, namely their disrespect of ethnic differences. Both recognize but one people, hominity, which is above ethnic provincialism.

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Daomei die Streunerin - religionsneutral, zivilisationsneutral, gildenneutral

#62 Added by Salazar 9 years ago [en]

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Yet the indoctrination starts in a Ranger Camp, namely on Silan ...

Last edited by Salazar (9 years ago)

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Salazar Caradini
Filira Matia
Royal Historian
Member of the Royal Academy of Yrkanis
First Seraph of the Order of the Argo Navis

#63 Added by Daomei 9 years ago [en]

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Lacuna

1) Agreed. But I don't mind the camp, but would be nicer to have it in PR, imo. ..

I see an issue in case of relocation of the camp. Mind that this camp was a provocation, a thorn in the flesh of the nations. If now the camp will me moved to Nexus or EF, those who frequently raided it will feel it a victory and giving in to their pressure. I fail to see many face saving ways of relocation.

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Daomei die Streunerin - religionsneutral, zivilisationsneutral, gildenneutral

#64 Added by Virg 9 years ago [en]

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Sorry to everyone who posted but I skim read 5 pages of comments so might repeat someone. I am simply going to post what I want (in the correct order) to happen to the marauder organisation. I have already begun making some of these things on ARK.

The reason for this post is because I believe that with these additions I would say the marauder organisation would be a great addition to the game and worth keeping.

NB: If you would like to reply to a particular idea, please use the colour used to highlight at least one word for easy referencing. Thanks.

1. Finishing the Lore: Gaueko is working hard on doing this. Looking forward to when he is done.

2. Marauder Occupation + NH: The marauder occupation should reflect well.. the marauders. In essence: A) We kill normal city guards. B) They drop racial tokens (imperial, federation etc.). C) We trade in to a special marauder NH for marauder organisational points, titles and dappers. The marauder occupation provides an excellent driver for RP and PVP involving other nations.

3. Camp Welcomer: You will agree with everything about this except 1 simple fact: I want part of the rewards to be a generic 1h sword and dagger plans. Yes, I hear people yelping already- "but everyone deserves access to the same things!!" Wrong... very wrong. Marauders can't access city gen plans so why should people be able to access marauder stuff? If you want the plans.. go marauder! If we want the other generic plans we have to leave marauder. Its exactly the same thing. If you'd like to disagree with me using this argument then please explain how I, as a marauder, can get the generic craft plans located in cities?

The colour I used is teal. For the forum code you want to write [color=teal]Virg you are moronic! Everyone should have access to craft plans.. even though marauders don't![/color].

4. Marauder missions: Self explanatory.

5. Craft merchants fixing: NPC HA craft merchants need fixing.

6. Almati Woods teleport: Assuming we already have our OOC teleport then a RP teleport isn't a top priority (which is why its 6). This would be cool to introduce some ranger-marauder cross RP.

7. Marauder OP drill+mats Zinukeen pink I think. I should imagine neutrals should also get the same and then building a drill should have fame restrictions. So marauders can only build a marauder drill etc etc.

8. Marauder teleport animation: Black smoke + zinukeen pink flashing lines. For players with -100 in all fame. Got to earn your style :P

9. Marauder pick: Can purchase using marauder organisation points.

10. Booze and gambling: Speciality craft marauder booze because tryker and fyros stuff just doesnt quite cut it. Also introduction of the brotherhood of the traveling gubani to the camp.

From here on out who knows! Maybe a second occupation, stealing the Pyr hottub etc etc..

I can dream of the day when the marauder organisation has all these things. Will be a wonderful great day.

Oh also.. I would define marauders as a multi-national organisation. We have a wide variety of players using different RP-stances from freedom-fighters to criminals. I can assure you that some of the freedom fighters still believe they belong to a particular nation but are just anti-government.

Edited 2 times | Last edited by Virg (9 years ago)

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#65 Added by Bitttymacod 9 years ago [en]

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As of the last time I checked, if a guild is aligned, building a drill in an OP that is of the opposite alignment is useless. You don't get anything out of it. Neutral guilds can use both, however.

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#66 Added by Virg 9 years ago [en]

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Well you can definitely build the wrong drill as Firstdo found out x)

I don't think they would have installed a fame checking script at mat distribution as instead they would have stopped you building the drill in the first place?

PS. Thanks for using the colour system :D

Last edited by Virg (9 years ago)

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#67 Added by Bitttymacod 9 years ago [en]

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Why stop you from wasting money? The experience will be valuable and you will never forget.

Edit: I happen to know this fact because it happened to me.

Last edited by Bitttymacod (9 years ago)

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#68 Added by Lacuna 9 years ago [en]

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Virg

3. Camp Welcomer: You will agree with everything about this except 1 simple fact: I want part of the rewards to be a generic 1h sword and dagger plans. Yes, I hear people yelping already- "but everyone deserves access to the same things!!" Wrong... very wrong. Marauders can't access city gen plans so why should people be able to access marauder stuff? If you want the plans.. go marauder! If we want the other generic plans we have to leave marauder. Its exactly the same thing. If you'd like to disagree with me using this argument then please explain how I, as a marauder, can get the generic craft plans located in cities?

As mentioned above, yes we can. :P I did to get long sword and 2 hand mace. You do get a little fame boost with that civ but it is very small. If mara worked the same with a negligible fame nerf at the point one gets the generic plans this wouldn't be an issue. I also think generic spear would be better. Pretty sure Tixi told me that it exists and from a crafter's point of view I think a generic spear plan is missed more than 1-hand sword or dagger.

Last edited by Lacuna (9 years ago)

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#69 Added by Mjollren 9 years ago [en]

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Virg

3. Camp Welcomer: You will agree with everything about this except 1 simple fact: I want part of the rewards to be a generic 1h sword and dagger plans. Yes, I hear people yelping already- "but everyone deserves access to the same things!!" Wrong... very wrong. Marauders can't access city gen plans so why should people be able to access marauder stuff? If you want the plans.. go marauder! If we want the other generic plans we have to leave marauder. Its exactly the same thing. If you'd like to disagree with me using this argument then please explain how I, as a marauder, can get the generic craft plans located in cities?

Everyone starts as a neutral, with access to all 4 generic plans from the nation welcomers. Moreover, the missions are incredibly easy to do, but for a small investment on your part (I think you are required to craft a few things of your own).

However, going marauder and getting out of marauder is a rather big time commitment. If you choose to go marauder right off the bat, I would say it's on you. You willingly forego access to a number of things, including but not limited to rites (+crafted item durability, +sap, +hp, +focus x2) and welcomer missions.

When compared, the tasks are imbalanced.

On one hand, someone who wishes to be anything but marauder would have to lower their fame, perform the marauder rite, AND raise their fame again, all for one generic plan. On the other hand, a future marauder only needs to wait a while until they complete the rites and missions that give them bonuses.

Edited 2 times | Last edited by Mjollren (9 years ago)

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#70 Added by Virg 9 years ago [en]

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@Bittty
I thought you were neutrally aligned Bittty? Therefore how would you know if a Kami drill won't produce Kami mats for a Kara guild?

@Lacuna
Ops sorry I wasn't aware that we still could. Although guard aggro makes the task a little harder than most? As for generic weapon plans I see an awful lot more marauders using 1h swords and daggers than I do using spears. This is something that marauders can decide when the time comes- as long as we are allowed the plans in the first place.

@Mjollren
Some have chosen to go marauder right off the bat and I wouldn't say its at all on them. Others have gone other paths right off the bat but they still get access to rites etc.

I have realised now I have put my point across wrongly so changing my stance somewhat:

Every alignment does have game implications and as you pointed out, particularly with rites. Marauders are affected more heavily by this as we are missing a lot of things ourselves. To help balance the scales somewhat I believe we should get unique access to generic generic plans. In 2 years time from now we definitely won't have an equal footing on rites etc- heck civs are getting more rites designed now even when marauders have none. If people want the plans then they can always go marauder similar to if it want all the rites we have to grind up all our fames.

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#71 Added by Lacuna 9 years ago [en]

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Mjollren

Virg
3. Camp Welcomer: You will agree with everything about this except 1 simple fact: I want part of the rewards to be a generic 1h sword and dagger plans. Yes, I hear people yelping already- "but everyone deserves access to the same things!!" Wrong... very wrong. Marauders can't access city gen plans so why should people be able to access marauder stuff? If you want the plans.. go marauder! If we want the other generic plans we have to leave marauder. Its exactly the same thing. If you'd like to disagree with me using this argument then please explain how I, as a marauder, can get the generic craft plans located in cities?

Everyone starts as a neutral, with access to all 4 generic plans from the nation welcomers. Moreover, the missions are incredibly easy to do, but for a small investment on your part (I think you are required to craft a few things of your own).

However, going marauder and getting out of marauder is a rather big time commitment. If you choose to go marauder right off the bat, I would say it's on you. You willingly forego access to a number of things, including but not limited to rites (+crafted item durability, +sap, +hp, +focus x2) and welcomer missions.

When compared, the tasks are imbalanced.

On one hand, someone who wishes to be anything but marauder would have to lower their fame, perform the marauder rite, AND raise their fame again, all for one generic plan. On the other hand, a future marauder only needs to wait a while until they complete the rites and missions that give them bonuses.

For the third time: you can do welcomer missions as Mara. Logically, therefore, you will be able to do welcomer missions from the Camp Welcomer without being Mara. The whole point of which would be that you do as a prelude to to the rite! No need to turn Mara! If there was a generic plan you might need to lose a little fame, if it is the same as the civ welcomer missions. Making this as fair as any gaining generic plan. Lacuna had to gain fame with Fyros and Matis to gain the plans something she found repulsive. Rites are something else. Virg is not asking for a reward as a rite.

Last edited by Lacuna (9 years ago)

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#72 Added by Lacuna 9 years ago Multilingual

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@Virg From when I was -100 Matis I think there is a fame cut off where the welcomer wont speak to you. I think it is fame not being mara that makes them not speak. But you can't have all in Ryzom. I would let the Camp Welcomer talk to everyone that wasn't aligned to Kami or Kara or a Civ. This would allow anyone to get the generic plan and then just realign. You may say that is harsh if you are max fame for Civ or Riligion and have to unalign to get plan: suck it up:P Like many I have had to grind fame up and down multiple times.

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