IDEAS FOR RYZOM

I only have one more thing to comment, and I will be done with this thread since it seems only Daomei cares about discussing the subject.

"Hopefully, the forge will allow to go some steps into
that direction, too. But personally, I would rather advise to new content like missions, regions etc. instead of touching the combat system." (Daomei said)

Personnally, I would simply advise to not build anymore things on an unstable foundation.

Anyway, thanks Daomei for your feedback on those ideas and I wish more people would express their opinion. I believe I have said everything I needed to, and hope more ideas will come for a more dynamic gameplay.

Well, this game does need something. We do have a test server. Time is better spent testing things rather than throwing out every idea that does come onto the forums. We are so comfortable with the way things are that we are afraid of even discussing them or trying them out on a test server. I'm fine with the game as is too. I use it as a pretty great chat program. We can go in circles about what we consider "hard" or "difficult" but fact is that this game will never progress until we actual consider moving out of our comfort zone. I personally do not consider anything in this game hard or difficult. The combat system is awesome because i have all the time in the world to heal and tank while watching tv without ever having to use an aura or self heal anyways. Healing is little to no effort since I can communicate with my team ahead of a fight. Since all of us are experts I don't need to explain how to heal a team and a tank and as an elemental top off a healer with one button and switch to nuke. ♥

And then you will say that I don't even log in or play anymore. My love for this game has not changed but my desire to log in has.

i've not given up yet bones on the forge, and still am working on my own projects personally little by little. I've been offered the help of RL programmers to assist me in my works, but i don't want to ask anyone to potentially waste their time should a project i'm working on be refused for any reason.

i personally won't submit anything for consideration until i think it's "done" partly because i want to be able to talk about my works freely and openly with anyone, unhindered by an NDA, and with the option for those that refuse to allow me to work alone the chance to join me. personally i feel half the reason that things people work on via the forge don't go live is because they are not able to freely talk about what they do if they officially join a team, the NDAs hurt the people working on things because they can't rally support for what they're doing, thus there's no outcry from the players that want to play the newly developed content someone has created.

another thing that i think will hinder the forge developers is the fact that translation is such a difficult issue, google translate doesn't do a good enough job because it can't translate ryzom names and other various game only words and references. i know there's a translation team for the ryzom forge, and i have no doubt they're very busy with many projects as there's likely not a large number of them to work on things.

the ryzom forge and it's teams has the POTENTIAL to do great things for ryzom, and while some might call ark (formerly know as arcc) shaky, it's the best we've got and it's better then nothing at all. ryzom can't afford at this current time to employ the number of dedicated programers it would take to learn the original nervax code and programming to replace ark. maybe there will come a day when ryzom will thrive enough for that to happen and that team of programers can code the features and content that ark has provided into the proper programming for ryzom code, and over time phase arc out from use on the live server. (arc would still be a good way for non programers to develop new content to turn over to that team of programers to then code into the game, thus arc would be the open-source development tool and the programers would be the final step to make something for the live server.)

but much like i said and as bones said, i don't see what's wrong with them as they are, and i don't even use 75% of them for much of anything at all.

let's work on new content that might draw back the masses that have left, and hope that extra income will lead to bug fixes and perhaps even more players returning to the bark. (and i'll say yes we're in our comfort zone, so let's get some new content that throws us out of it.)

talk, long-winded as ever.

+1 to Klrs' last post, and last post for me as well.

It is a shame how poeple who play this game still think anything will change - owner is quite happy gathering the subs at the end of each month - and nothing will be changed here - I have no idea why people are still being misled about new changes via Forge ...

I come late to this argument, but I have to say first, that the proposed disconnect of the auras from each other and from other players is MUCH more than changing a few constants in the code.  The interactions between the auras/protections/heals is built into the code.  The durations and cooldowns are just constants to be adjusted, but the rest is coding, and not simple coding either.  (I'm speaking conceptually, not from any knowledge of the actual code.)

In addition, if those changes had been in effect when I started the game I never would have stayed and learned to appreciate all that Atys is.  You won't be attracting *more* people (necessarily), just *different* people, and you will be removing one refuge of careful gameplay for yet another button-mashing twitch game.

My opinions.

Bitty and Daomei already expressed what I'm feeling, so I won't repeat.

But one point I do want to make: The posts in favour of this idea express a certain viewpoint based on a certain style of playing games and underlying assumptions/expectations about how a game should be working.

I would believe though that this is not representing the majority of the players. And as Bitty pointed out: it does us no good if we exchange one crowd with another. Well, i don't want to be replaced ;-)

there's so much you can do from day one onwards in ryzom that you could spend weeks playing content without levelling at all. Travelling has been named in this forum dozens of times, occupations, of course, roleplay, just watching the fauna live their lives. I always tell new players too not grind levels to 250 too quickly. What for? If the only goal is too be able to kill high level mobs, you need a team anyway. In a team, except for Pei, you will be welcome even at a low level. So what's the hurry? And if it's for pvp, why can't folks organize tournaments at comparable levels?

This is a sandbox game. This also means you have to put work into enabling your personal playing style. Tournaments do not happen if nobody organizes them, roleplay is entirely in players hands (and those players who put additional time into the event team).

I also believe that we are not afraid of change as Bonny said. With the limited development happening, it's all a matter of priorities. Changing a working combat system is not a priority, imho. Ryzomforge is somewhat different: open source folks tend to work on just those things that mean fun to them. See Talk's post. Some of those rogue ideas make it into the game, some not. Did we really need an achievement system? Imho not. But SirCotare had fun doing it, he did it, and that feature did not break anything - so it happened and got accepted for inclusion into Ryzom. There was once code to degrade mats over time. Great idea. All wasted work, if you want, because it never made it into the game. It would have broken the load on the server.

It's ok to fervently defend one's ideas. But do not be disappointed if it does not store the same enthusiasm with this little community. We have to face the reality of what can be developed currently and with which priority.

I've said it before, I'll say it again: the game feels like a movie. And considering the not-so-subtle influences of Kaena, I'm not surprised.

Going on Irfidel's theme, having a sandbox is pretty useless if your only tools is a broken spade and a bucket of water. You could make a decent nature documentary in Ryzom, but not an action movie or a dramatic one.

Yes, I keep hearing that "you could". Sure, you could organize tournaments. Why the hell don't people rush to organize tournaments, then? Hint: player base is too low in order to find even 20 people of similar levels, mechanics suck when going against someone even 15 levels higher (much better dodge, higher chance to resist magic, etc). This is just one particular example.

At some point, you will have to suck it up and understand your player base needs a fun (or addictive) activity to perform constantly, without a lot of time investment on the player's part. Digging is not fun. Leveling is not fun and can't be done in large groups. Roleplay requires Event Team intervention or a lot of scripting and make-believe. There is nothing I can think of that will keep me *entertained* for 3 continuous hours in Ryzom, without getting bloody repetitive. Recipe-making for a select few, perhaps.

Every moderately active guild will tell you that new players never stay. They play for a while, sink up time and effort, then when nearing 125 they draw a line and figure they don't want to sink years into the game. They don't find entertainment value in it.

I don't care what keeps the current player base entertained, because whatever it is, it's a proven loser's recipe, slowly bleeding out people. I care what would keep *more* players interested.

Ahem.
OK, here I lose you completely.  If "your player" needs that, then they should be playing solitaire, sudoku or Bubble Monkey Pop Juice Candy Farm.  I have not met an MMO that does not involve a lot of time investment on the player's part and a significant amount of grind.  As for the staying power of new players, churn is also a feature of all games.


Digging is not fun for YOU, it's fun for me.  Leveling CAN be done in large groups (e.g. Shalah and Plod teams, and use of multiple teams in the same area).  You say that there should be a fun or addictive activity and then you criticise repetitiveness.  The two are inversely related (see any dungeon crawler).

As for Roleplay, it's inherently make-believe!  How can it not be?

If you have ideas for things that will improve the game, make them explicit and work them out (in detail).  As Irfidel pointed out, some things do get implemented, some things don't.  However, if an idea is not well worked out, it is guaranteed not to get implemented!
-- Just my thoughts.

That grind must be either fun or addictive (think rats pressing a lever for random cheese drops addictive, there's a study on this). Ryzom promises neither. You grind just because you're required to - impossible to hit some mobs or players otherwise - not because you want to unlock some high level fun content.
See above. Nothing is fun about pressing "4" to heal, for 30 minutes/level at 240. This is a grind you just *have* to slog through, if you want to compete with others in actual gameplay. And usually grind is rewarded with something (you know, dangling the carrot) - Ryzom doesn't dangle anything.

For every person that says Ryzom's grind is fun, I hear 10-20 others who say it's not, or just quietly slip away because of the state of affairs.

I can sit on a stool and tell you that it's badly designed - sometimes even "why". But I could not tell you how to design and build a good stool, that's not my craft.

I am not a game designer or architect. There is a reason why those actually have a job with its own title, and get paid significant money for it. To come and tell me unironically that I should do this job for free (even if I were qualified for it) is just crass.

I just had to pass by, to approve almost everything Mjollren said.
*nods to Mjollren and goes away again*
PS : Did I forget to mention - Grinding is not funny in this game.

+1.