Embassies

[HRP] Chers joueurs,

L'Équipe d'Animation se doit d'intervenir dans ce sujet délicat afin de rappeler certains éléments essentiels :

Importance du respect mutuel
Les joueurs RP et HRP partagent le même serveur. Certes, leur façon d'appréhender le jeu est différente, mais ce n'est pas incontournable si chacun fait des efforts. Lorsqu'un souci comme celui-ci se présente, si vous ne parvenez pas à trouver une solution en discutant sereinement  ensemble, alors nous vous conseillons de vous tourner vers un médiateur. Dans le cas présent, l'Équipe d'Animation peut être appelée en premier vu qu'il s'agit d'un problème né d'un roleplay. 

Qu'est-ce qu'un event RP ?
C'est un event dans lequel les joueurs jouent le rôle de leur personnage, à la fois de manière cohérente et dans le respect de la Lore de Ryzom. Dans ce type d'event, les amitiés entre joueurs ne doivent pas être prises en compte : c'est l'histoire du jeu et le vécu des personnages qui dictent la conduite de ces derniers.

Qu'est-ce qu'un event HRP ?
C'est un event qui n'est lié ni à la cohérence de l'histoire, ni au vécu des personnages. Un event HRP est avant tout un moment convivial partagé par tous les joueurs le désirant, sans autre but que celui de s'amuser ensemble. Dans ce type d'event, l'histoire du jeu et le vécu des personnages ne comptent pas, seule la convivialité du moment importe. 

Intervenir de façon hors role play (HRP) dans un event roleplay (RP) est tout aussi irrespectueux que condamner le sens roleplay (RP) d'un event hors role play (HRP). 

Qu'est-ce qu'une assemblée et quelle est la portée de ses décisions ?
Chaque nation est représentée par des assemblées constituées de joueurs et dirigées par un animateur. Ces assemblées se réunissent régulièrement et peuvent édicter des "lois" sur leur territoire ; ces "lois", sont souvent proposées par les joueurs eux-mêmes et doivent être validées par l'animateur (qui en réfère à l'Animation), ce qui constitue un garde-fou et l'assurance du respect de la Lore. 
Une assemblée est un event RP. Ses "lois" n'ont qu'une portée roleplay.

Que nous apprend la Lore sur les Maraudeurs ?
Lors du premier Essaim (bien avant vos personnages), une grande partie des homins, aidée des Puissances, a pu fuir les Anciennes Terres et recréer des nations dans les Nouvelles. 
Les homins restés bloqués sur les Anciennes Terres ont survécu difficilement au milieu des kitins. Un homin, Melkiar, les a uni sous le nom de Maraudeurs ; pour Melkiar et les siens, les homins des Nouvelles Terres et les Puissances les ont abandonnés aux kitins. C'est pourquoi ils sont avides de revanche et de vengeance.
Les Maraudeurs des Anciennes Terres ont recruté sur les Nouvelles Terres des homins qui avaient de la colère à exprimer, les ont endoctrinés pour servir leurs plans. Parmi ces nouveaux Maraudeurs, on peut trouver des idéalistes qui croient vraiment au discours de  Melkiar, mais aussi des opportunistes qui cherchent à profiter de sa  puissance et de sa technologie, ainsi que divers réprouvés des nations  qui évitent ainsi la prison et peuvent donner libre cours à leurs pulsions guerrières. ( http://atys.ryzom.com/projects/3/wiki/L_maraudeurs_civilisation ) 
( http://app.ryzom.com/app_lore/index.php?page=/projects/pubfr/wiki /L_Maraudeurs_civilisation )

De façon RP, les Maraudeurs sur les nouvelles Terres ne sont pas des gentils, mais au contraire les méchants de l'histoire, des agitateurs, des criminels. Il est possible que parmi ces Maraudeurs, certains doutent, aient un autre point de vue, mais les Maraudeurs sont vus par les Nations comme des gens méchants, des bandits qui sont malvenus et qu'on tente de chasser à coup de piques quand ils sont repérés.

Cela est d'ailleurs appuyé par le gameplay qui demande à tout Maraudeur d'être haï par chaque nation et religion (renommée très négative), puis d'assassiner six homins, avant de passer son rite pour être accepté comme Maraudeur des Nouvelles Terres.

Maraudeurs et marché tryker
Dans ce contexte roleplay, qu'une nation (ici la nation tryker) crée des lois déclarant que les Maraudeurs sont malvenus sur ses terres, et que s'ils viennent au marché (event organisé de façon RP), ils seront chassés, est légitime, logique et cohérent. 
Dans ce contexte roleplay également, le fait que les Maraudeurs se désintéressent ou violent les lois d'une nation qu'ils ne reconnaissent pas est également légitime, logique et cohérent.
Par conséquent, si des Maraudeurs viennent sur le marché de Fairhaven malgré l'interdiction, il est normal que les gardes essaient de les chasser, voire tentent de les tuer, et que les marchands refusent de leur vendre quoi  que ce soit (à moins d'échanger leur vie contre les marchandises ... ).

Concrètement, rien dans le gameplay n'interdira aux joueurs de Maraudeurs de venir au marché ; il sera cependant demandé aux joueurs de respecter le côté roleplay de l'event, et de ne pas le perturber en harcelant via le PVP (il est par contre possible d'échanger quelques mots, de se battre un peu, puis de repartir).

Et le droit de jouer comme on veut et où on veut ?
Ici encore, tout est une question de respect. La liberté des uns s'arrête où commence celle des autres. Les joueurs de Maraudeurs ont le droit de participer à un marché. Que ce soit pour des raisons gameplay ou roleplay. Mais autant voir les Maraudeurs faire quelques courts raids RP sur le marché en représailles serait logique, autant voir la bataille dériver sur le plan HRP et devenir une bataille verbale entre joueurs, allant jusqu'à exclure des joueurs d'un futur event HRP, ne l'est pas. Cela ne serait que le début d'une escalade sans fin et nuisible à tous.
Pourquoi ne pas, par exemple, profiter du Marché Noir qui, lui, se veut HRP et donc ouvert à tous ? Ou préparer un event RP "Mister Maraudeur", excluant tout participant non maraudeur ?

Que faire si le conflit ne s'apaise pas ?
Si malgré cela, les choses continuent de déraper, l'Équipe de Support est là pour conseiller et veiller au bon respect des règles de courtoisies. Le cas échéant, elle peut être amenée à prendre des sanctions allant de l'avertissement au ban définitif, selon le dossier du joueur.


Nous espérons que ces précisions pourront vous aider.

Et n'oubliez pas que Ryzom est un jeu ! [/HRP]

 
the link only says this about their aggression: Marauders of the Old Lands vehemently reject both the Kamis and the Karavan and will fight those who support either religion

it does not say this:
Aris maurauders did not wait in the pvp zones of Prime Roots to kill homins, they were not massively villains of the story, agitators, and criminals

I am concerned that this hatred of them in role play clashes with the way they were seen on Aris server

[OOC] Several posts have been moved towards a new topic. [/OOC]
[HRP] Certains posts ont été déplacés vers un nouveau sujet.[/HRP]

Marauders

Tamarea thank you for your post however I personally feel that it was written with a complete bias towards roleplayers. Firstly I would like to quote you twice:

1. [FH] market (a RP event)

2. A non-RP event is above all a good time shared by all players who want nothing but to have fun together. During such an event, the game's story and the experiences of the characters are of no importance. Only the feel of the moment matters.

These two statements are complete utter contradictions, at the very least in reference to the FHF experienced on Ari. You talk of respect but where was the respect offered to the players who were on Ari when the Tryker RPers hijacked the FHF, twisted it into a RP event and solely excluded the marauders from it.

I will add a third quote which I feel will sum up my thoughts on the situation at hand, and reflects many others as well:

3. [It is] disrespectful [to] roleplay at a non-roleplay event.

I don't think I need to mention the particular CoC you have quoted and the thought that what some players have done could be considered against it...

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I have spoken to many Ari players and even ones who don't usually agree with me all the time and many have backed up exactly what I believe; That the FH fair on ari was not a RP event, instead it was an event for the server. In fact, let me quote a friend:

"FHF is not in my mind a Tryker event, but an Atysian event put on by the Trykers. That being the case, all homins should be welcome. In addition is is an event with a very LOW RP factor".

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Your own personal take on marauders is far too outdated. Many old players roleplayed as such and where are they now? They all left. Instead, Syndicate has now attempted to revitalise the Marauder faction, many players even leaving their own faction, their lovely hard fought and won q250 OPs and sadly some friends as well. This was, for me at least, a huge sacrifice. One that I took upon myself to make for the better of the game.

The marauders currently have, as I am sure you are aware, no meetings, no events, no missions and certainly no RP made for us. I understand this is supposed to come, but that was several months ago. Instead everything we do, we make up ourselves. Any other events that are made can be considered a little treat for us, something we can do without having to put any effort into creating it. So I am sure you can imagine my reaction when I read that I will not be allowed into the FHF, a server-wide non-roleplay event. The most RP that has actually ever been brought to an Ari FHF was a little speech I once made about tryker freedom, it lasted less than 2 minutes and that was about it.

There are little events as it is these days- do we really need to start excluding people from it? I know many of the higher-powers that be are set on removing the marauders from the game and I can only imagine their delight when CSN left but the marauders bring a much needed third point of the triangle to OP wars. This game, despite much outspoken hate against PVP, would be dead without it.

I do not roleplay much, but when I do it is nothing like how CSN used to roleplay. Think about what we have seen recently- the Karas and Marauders fighting together at an OP battle. The game has changed and the roleplay adapts.

I won't delve much into the roleplay that I personally follow but it can be found here as are several links below it. Just have a thought for a second, I was in another faction first, like many other marauders, am I just meant to suddenly start roleplaying that I was left behind in another land and hate the people who deserted me? Sounds stupid to me.

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To expand on my views of a "nation", one which no one has actually even attempted to properly speak against even though choosing to openly dismiss it. The marauders are an organisation, we are NOT a nation. We are actually, a multi-national organization. Although we may not like the governments that run those particular nations we are still bound to the nations through many particular ties. If you disagree feel free to state reasons why, but stop dismissing this without actually thinking about it.

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I feel it is a real shame that it had to come down to massive discussions on the forums and on uni- I believe that I tried to approach the situation with both OOC and RP reasons for change, and even offered a RP reason why we should be able to attend the fair.

What solution did you have in mind?

Trying to put together an Aris history for mara homins ... also trying to recover from some suggestions from Aniro homins about what should have happened to Nizyros

And I think we have to discuss this Virg - because this seems a big clash between the Aris and Aniro community - and again we are doing this on role play forum ... oh well

Well when a previously seen (on Ari) non-RP event ends up being turned into a RP event (non-RP->RP) one can only assume that people will get angry and try and turn it back around (RP->non-RP). The shame is that it is on the RP forum in the first place where imo it doesn't belong (Ref: Tamarea's definitions).

I had a little read on Nizy's case and could not quite believe that they wanted to completely stop him from playing on that account all together. After X many years of work.. Well in doing so they aren't really doing any positive promotion (imo) for RP. "Hey come RP and we will try to stop you playing on your main toon!"

Hopefully we can find a fix but all of my propositions have been turned down without much reason or rhyme.

Makes me think we should have a warning for new refugees - as in potential subbed homins - Beware what race and alligence you take - it makes a huge difference to your experience of the game - and to be honest I find that very sad

I can point out here that the Support crew could do a rename if requested as a way out of the RP "killing Nizyros". A name change and a new tattoo and we put him on the protective services plan and it's all good. I'm assuming that Nizyros was voluntarily playing the villain in this scenario.

-- B.

OOC
But hell's bells Bittty - do you not see this as something over the top? The RP Nizyros has done is fine and was carefully worked out - time has been spent on it - this criticism is just obsessive and, also, means all refugees should get a warning about what race and alliance they choose when they start the game - which in my opinion is just not right!

Nizyros is automatically a villain - according to Aniro lore - see what is written above - but he has had his name for some 10 years I suspect - so this is just not on!

> Actually Tamarea you got to kill nobody or 1-2 tops to do mara lore it's been broken for months!!!!!!!!!!!

Then again:

English NON-RP discussion versus French RP means we need to ask the French RP event team to fix it?????

Sorry but tamarea in all of this you are part of  the problem here, you are part of the community the discussion is about or against or who knows. Yes Tos or CoC says somewhere me telling you that is a bannable offence so go on.

It still comes down to how different servers where and you coming from the other server have no rights to tell us coming from ari that our way of playing was/is wrong.
I feel sorry for you but on ari mara was played differently and Akilla and such who we meat trough roleplay on our server was portrayed differently aswell.

I come from a server where my fame meant nothing for my gameplay and I want that server back. I hate ryzom more and more by the day sadly because it's now a game where just some players got all the rights to pester you away RP wise. RP is nice but pestering ppl away with RP is whats going on now but I guess me telling you wich is part of that RP group will do nuthing!!!

We all like/liked ryzom for what It got but it's easy kind off atm RP players RP so are in contact with event team, Non-RP players don't RP so are in contact with nobody and only got these forums to react to what the RP community is doing to them.


.... 

=> rant over for now hope to all see you ingame and be friendly but I guess thats impossible since I'm not even allowed by the french to rez them (yes I get insults if I rez a player I see death these days)

=> Will haplly sub 4 accounts instead of 2 now to support this game if we get our old server and way of playing back since now I play a game wich i'm starting to hate on this server.

Please mind the language when posting, edited to remove offensive swearing.

This is true Subbo - and not having an OOC forum to discuss it all on is really not good - we have a community issue here and this is a community problem - though maybe it is not a problem for the hard-line role players?

I tried to write "History" of our experience on Aris - but probably no one much is reading it ...

Bittty, I can point out that Icus actually stated that he didn't want a namechange to happen- just the char to stop playing all together. Many roleplayers themselves give such a bad impression of what it is like to roleplay. I have attended many different meetings (some in peace, others to RP-PVP) and players can be nothing but intrusive and rude, only coming out of RP to swear at you. Recently whilst attempting to talk about the FHF fair issues, which I went out of my way to find a RP reason, I was merely told by a RP player to fuck off, on the uni channel, without any attempt to engage in my said RP. I have know a few great RPers who attempt to get everyone on board, but they are small in number (Grizabella, The person behind "Convict" and some other chars). At least many PvPers attempt to be advocates of the activity they love.

It is sad that it is these types RPers, many who are just simply nasty, have the ears of the higher powers that be. The marauders for example have been waiting for fixes to happen for months, even years for some content. The tryker RPers want something new to happen and it occurs within 24 hours. They want new guards to fight marauders? *snap* Its done. How about first giving the marauders guards that actually work and perhaps have hands? It's the little things in life...

The one exception I would like to point out was our barmaid getting a quick fix for which I am very grateful.