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I really don't want to contribute to the alt discussion.. but maybe we could solve it once and for all by having an experimental battle where Yaka is only allowed to bring 1 alt. (We could also agree that nobody is allowed to bring more than one alt, but I specify Yaka just cause he's the one people have been complaining about).

If we still get creamed then at least people would have to stop blaming Yaka's army.. if not then maybe it really has been a factor worth considering. It's just a thought..

I do not think anyone is really saying Yaka's army wins battles - just makes it hard/impossible to kill him!

But I do think, after a chat with a Kara Tryker homin after the battle, that pvp jools are a must, Pei LA helps (can be killed every hour), Helmets help on mages, having 3 amps in bag with diff enchants helps (wish there was a fast way of re-loading the things tho - and make sure you have good sap load on the craft of amps) and making sure the tank in your team and the 2 nukers keep on their feet helps, assisting the tank's target by affies helps and the use of f2p for healing the healers helps - then shooting the guards to drag them out of the op helps ...

Also not inviting all Kami to come to a battle helps level the playing field as well - as Asylum spokes-homin said

Why don't you all try (speaking to both factions and no one in particular) to do a real WAR without using alt...

I really would like to see what would happend because there is people with courage (people n.3) and people who need alt or they feel weak (people n.1)...

Or maybe this people just want to keep the game like it is now till the death of it...and they are gonna play only with their own alts because many people are gonna leave... (sounds funny playing alone, but those kind of people from my point of view has misunderstood Ryzom)

This topic is degrading into a discussion about alts. There are many alt users on both sides. Lets steer this away from a discussion about alts. Make a separate topic if you want to talk about that.

My answer is in the right topic...You spoke about the kind of people we are..well you forgot the kind of people who use alt...they are not in your list :P

Regardless of if it does or doesn't, a conversation about alts will turn sour. I would rather this topic was not blocked.

But it is all part of the same topic ...

Guildie came up with good idea:
When 1st round is won attacking side take off one piece of armour
Another piece on winning the 2nd round
If they loose 3rd - they can put back on a piece of armour
And so on - thus giving the defenders a better chance of defending

Matis might get banned ofc - being as they are far too  bright with no armour on!

Here's the facts : it took a server merger to undo the previous power balance with Karavan on top. They were dominating completely, just like kami are doing now. I'm quite sure there were plenty of Virgs to tell kamis "yeah, you're underpowered and undernumbered, but you can TOTALLY do it".

Maybe this comic explains it better than me? http://www.marriedtothesea.com/index.php?date=012710

Anyway, you're just an aggravating ***** at this point, as other people have pointed out more politely in this thread. Your guild soloes NPC bosses, the kami faction could have all OPs on Atys if it wanted to, but you keep insisting the other side can TOTALLY recover. Just shut up already.

Developer oversight (or carelessness) does not make things right. We should have mounting costs to keep declaring, mounting difficulty and so forth. Otherwise you end up with the current situation.

I heard that on Arispotle the winning side actually gave back outposts, just so there could be further fun? Maybe you kamis should do that instead of being the smug ****** that you are.

Just for the record, Victoriancamper is in no way related to me, although I'm quite flattered that someone follows my victorian + camping beliefs.

As to the current topic: I do not beliefe all the people who left did so just because there is a lack of OutPost battles, although I aknowledge it *could* be a part of it.

In fact, I think people have left in the past for a rather excess of battles (+ the continuous lack of new content, inaccesibility to the dev team, ideas being ignored, characters being wiped etc.).

You keep saying people could actually do something at OPs  if they put in the effort but seriously, i have a hard time believing 15 launchers vs 50 (I have no clue on numbers, just said a random amount) would stand any chance, and after constant attempts people get tired.

You also don't want to speak about alts but it's not just about monstrous undying homins with (12k heals every 2.8 seconds) let alone 12k damage on a single homin, or a synced bomb on a pod, i think (and i'm just assuming) that that is not all that Elvanae meant, I think that on top of the proper alts, she was also speaking of the very common practice amongst the kamis of sharing accounts, if you mix that + the dexterity of some to control numerous toons at the same time.. well you have some advantage.

In any case, must remember everyone also has a RL to take care of and that theres only so much a homin can do to try to match your force.

Just my 2 cents, I don't even play anymore so could be completely mistaken, others will say.

Bina,

You forgot that praying to Ma Duk is what helps the most.

Rollocks
Karavanist Butcher

+1 on Elvanaes comments
+1 on Bitttymacods comments too, especially #16
+1 on all Binarabi's comments too

Assylum is turning out to be Temproray Insantiy #2. the guild that destroyed us before merge. No wonder since there are lots of former members. Very experienced.
I really dont care about Yakas alts, anyone can learn to do that or pay for it. It is easy to foul that system up with correct tactics.
However... Virg, your logic on getting a bunch of launcher people out there is not valid. To avoid that threat all you do is scatter or spread out.
Plus, I'm not sure people are leaving the game for lack of pvp, or OP fights. I think constantly losing is very discouraging to a player, or a player base. Have you ever experienced that? I think not. I have. Nobody likes to constantly lose.

As for Tuxis comments, How can wannabe pvp'rs get to be good pvp'rs when they can hold any OP's or win any fights? they cant get the good mats which the richer do get richer.

If the most recent example can be of any indication, then it seems that many No. 3's are either slipping into No. 2's or quitting all together. It's not something that I like to see happen but it appears there is no other explanation for the lack of attendance. Maybe final exams? I hope that's the case. I don't want to see atys become lifeless.

On a good note, there was a lack of trash talk and I am proud of both sides for being so mature and allowing everyone to enjoy themselves. If anything, it is a step in the right direction.

On a low note, A very close personal friend of mine being controlled by another person just doesn't sit right with me. I don't really think that this is necessary but that's just the way I play. I have played for years and just recently started using an alt to careplan, she is level 20. On the other hand, they chose to share their account info so.....

Victoria wrote.
"practice amongst the kamis of sharing accounts"

please forgive my lack of proper forum quoting...

Honestly i don't really want to spend my online time building up a faction to get a chance at OPs against a bunch of people who have mastered the art of it.. Its supposed to be enjoyable, not something else to worry about.

Maybe Ryzom is no longer for me, should i leave? Did i already ? ^^

Virg, in my opinion, the only reason people leave Ryzom is the lack of freedom in the gameplay and NOT the lack of OP battles. It's the contrary.

"Lack of freedom" in Ryzom????? Ryzom, a classless, fully sandbox MMORPG known as one of the few with a real freedom for the player to build its own character?

Yes, lack of freedom.

Actually to fully play the game a new player have no other choice than follow what some other people decide.
Even in the RP part there is a lack of freedom, because all decisions are simply made by one RP community and nothing seems can be done to change this.

In the past, there were real alternatives in the gameplay, and PvP was not the main part of it. Tho, it was a fun activity to do sometimes, for both losers and winners. Now PvP is the main focus of the game. More, since the merge, Ryzom turned as a full PvP game.

A strong community is a real good thing for a game, but when this community is not guided and mitigated by correct game mechanics and by an experienced team of developers that actually care of the game, and never favour a single side, then everything go broken.

When a game is owned by (some) player, unbalance and frustration is the only possible result for any new people that want really experience the no-more-as-in-the-past freedom of Ryzom.

This is just my opinion.

Firstly to all the people saying people aren't leaving the game because of the lack of OP battles.. please read the actual post. The post was primarily to address those people who think like that, of which I know there are many. I made this topic for 3 reasons:
1) To basically tell all the people who complain about the situation that if you want something to change, the OP battles are a PvP mechanic, and you will need to put some effort in. If you don't want to put effort in, stop complaining.
2) To show the Kara that it still can be done and point out kami-kara always fluctuate.
3) To get everyone else views on the current situation at hand.

Yes Bina, alts are part of it however a conversation about alts will just get messy (feel like I'm having to repeat myself a fair bit here). I could for example point out Yorran, from what I saw, was in control of more alts than Yakapo at the last war I attended. Now that would be controversial that many people wouldn't have known about would they?? Stop bashing Yakapo for the love of Ma-Duk.

Well VNC at least I am trying to do something about situation rather than hiding behind alt names to insult people on the forums. At least be brave enough to say things on your real account. As for being smug, as I have said many times, either players banter is misinterpreted, or it was in response to the untagged yelk dragging which was illegal.

VC at one OP battle over Loria 15 launchers wiped the other side (who did have a fairly large force) in under a minute.

VC and Arturia, I know of many karas that share accounts. People seem to point at kamis saying "Oh wow look they do this! This is wrong!", completely forgetting it happens within their own faction just as much.

Naema when you scatter and spread out you loose the efficiency of heal bombs which when concerning large numbers is very necessary. When the marauders PvPed with large numbers they always stayed alive granted but, in my opinion, due to the lack of a heal pod or heal bombs they weren't efficient enough to do any real damage.

Helgah no you shouldn't leave. One of the points I am making is that if you don't want to engage in OP battles and put some effort into them, then they probably aren't something you should be rating the game on. That would be like someone saying "Oh I can't get a q250 Kami Skirt because other people kill me so I can't earn points off them. This sucks I'm going to leave the game".

Gilgameesh I would completely disagree that PvP is the main focus of Ryzom. Being a PvPer myself there are actually very little opportunities to PvP compared to that of PvE and RP. People seem to be attributing the lack of OP wars or the dominance of one faction in OP wars as the downfall of the game. It is just a simple PvP mechanic. Yes politics took control for quite some time. It doesn't have much say these days thats all.