Looting as an answer to the outpost lock-out - IDEAS FOR RYZOM

#1 Added by Bitttymacod 1 decade ago [en]

In another thread, Afriel suggested the following:

Afriel

I just have a weird idea on how to increase op wars. What I observed from the current setup is that a reward is lacking.

Supposed we change the mechanics and add something like:
1st phase
- every round an attacker wins, will get 1 mat the OP produce
- the max mats the attacker can get is the current threshold of the OP

2nd phase
- attacker can not get anymore mats as max mats was obtained on the 1st phase

Again, I'm sorry if I hijack the thread, but I think this will make more sense, it is more realistic since the attacker won a round then there is a possibility that the attacker looted something. Hehehehe. I think this will increase OP wars.

Daomei and I were discussing this, and while getting one OP mat per round won seems very high on the reward side, we thought that the idea had merit in terms of a real incentive to attack an OP, even if you thought you were sure to lose in the long run. Therefore our modifications, with admiration to Afriel for his inspiration. (I am presenting this and have developed it. Daomei may chime in with other comments.)

1st Phase is the only important phase, as with Afriel's idea.

For each round the attackers win, there is chance of obtaining one OP mat (delivered to the person who kills the last guard). The exact chance might be modified, but I think a 33% (25%?) chance is reasonable. (RP: During the winning round, one lucky attacker might find an OP mat in the hopper for the drill output prior to its being delivered into the GH of the OP holder)

Each time the attackers get an OP mat, it is subtracted from future production of the OP. (I.e. when the OP would normally produce a mat, if there are any liens on the production it will fail to produce.) (RP: It was taken out of the hopper, it can't be delivered.)

Attackers can win no more than 5 mats, no matter how many times they win a round. (RP: That's how many OP mats might be in the hopper at any one time.) This keeps attackers from going for every other round for the full length of the war and possibly picking up 12 mats.

Advantages to the attacker: They might get one or more OP mats without actually winning the battle for the OP. This gives a great incentive to attack with all the force you can muster. In addition, each one they win is one less for the opposing guild/faction/alliance. Result: More battles.

Advantage to massive PvP: Defender wants to bring as much defensive force as possible to avoid losing mats.

Advantage to mercenaries: OP mats are suddenly on the open market as potential rewards.

I don't see a downside other than possible coding problems for the devs.

-- Bittty (with extreme thanks to Afriel)

Last edited by Bitttymacod (1 decade ago)

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#2 Added by Virg 1 decade ago [en]

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This is a very good idea and some good developments on it, however I believe some more fine-tuning is definitely needed.

Here is a possible scenario that could arise from the current version of the idea. This does assume some factors, such as having the dappers to declare on OPs regulary (something I know very little about) and of course also assumes that the attacks earn 5 OP mats every "visit" without winning. This is a worse case scenario, however it is a very real possibility:

If the attacker can get 5 OP mats per OP war I would see people attacking lots. This of course is the benefit- lots of OP wars. However if they attack 3 times a week they would get a total of 15 OP mats. This is more than the guild holding the OP would get in terms of production in week. Attacking regularly for a few weeks would cause a huge deficit of OP mats to the extent it would take months to repay the debt before the OP owners even got another OP mat. This would be a huge disadvantage to holding an OP, whilst the attackers get all the production and future production for not even winning the OP.

This is a good idea however I believe it needs fine-tuning to prevent the above scenario happening, otherwise no one would really want to hold an OP that produces no mats.

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#3 Added by Daomei 1 decade ago [de]

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Some short comments:

I liked the idea as well and discussed it a while with Bittty. My first concern was about potential abuse during handovers. Thus the proposal 1st of a cap of mats being conquered, and 2nd of a reduction of OP output equivalent to the stolen mats. That would make it a zero sum game, not a means of generating OP mat from nowhere.

The idea is that an attacker may win at most 5 pieces per attack phase. With an average chance of something between 20..33% (or possibly more or less), an attacker could leave with 0 mat in worst and 5 mat in best case, given a gain of at least 5 rounds (that would be extremely lucky). An average unsuccessful attacker who won, say 11 rounds but not in sequence, might leave with 3 to 4 mats. It would be an incentive, too, not to give up an attack only because the threshold cannot be reached anymore.

I do not see how an OP can be attacked several times during a week. I am not aware of the recent rules, but as far as I recall there always was a 2day period from declaration of war, then attack phase (24hrs), and defense phase (24hrs) max 2 days after attack, lasting 24hrs as well. That made (correct me if I am wrong) a max 6 and min 4 day wartime period from declaration to final result (with the OP war spam vanishing to the relief of the poor diggers nearby ;)). After that, there was, if I recall correctly, a minimum peace period of a week until the next declaration of war was possible.

I am not aware of the weekly production of recent OPs. In the old times, half and half mat/cats was common, with an output of about 1 mat per day iirc, even less taking in account degrades. Nowadays, there are no cats anymore, I heard, though, that mat yield is not much above half and half of the old times. OP holders kindly comment ;). Baseline for a number of max 5 mats loot per attack was that no more than the wartime production could be lifted from the OP.

Last edited by Daomei (1 decade ago)

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