IDEAS FOR RYZOM

Virg --

I think it is very unlikely that a dev or CSR would comment on this thread since they can't get any positive result by doing so. If they comment positively, the next demand will be "When?". If they comment negatively, the next thing will be "Why not?".

We know from the past that the developers and support staff read these forums and that sometimes, months or years later, we see results.

As for the OP battles, you may be right that the Marauders came out in force for the last set of them, but how many Marauders are actually hard-core PvP players and how many just saw an opportunity for one of their own to take an OP? I don't know, but I'm willing to bet that not all Marauders are in it for the PvP, just as not all non-Marauders dislike PvP. I think the role-play and PvP attitude lines are pretty much skew to each other.

Nuno --

I love the idea, but there is really nothing now that would keep the PvP players from occupying the Arena and holding games under the same restrictions. I've wondered for some time why there isn't a PvP post in the Forums keeping track of PvP matches(single, double, four-homin team, full kit, basic kit, naked) with records of wins, losses, etc.

With a little work on the part of the PvP players they could set up betting pools for the season, side-bets on individual matches. Homins not interested in PvP otherwise might get involved in the gaming aspect of it, both as part of the game and as part of roleplay. (I would hope that any Fyros Patriot would support an honorable Fyros warrior who is showing his/her skill in fair combat!)

That doesn't answer the question of "should there be more in-game reward for PvP activities," but it would certainly show the devs and CSRs that there was a lot of interest in it.

-- just my thoughts -- I leave the details to those interested.

Nuno I like the idea- however getting specific gear to suit your playing style is one of the great things I enjoy about pvp.

Bitty- what is the issue with me wanting to know when this might happen? or why this wont happen? am i wasting my time continuing to post on this thread?

Every single marauder I know loves to PvP and it always up for PvP- hence they are tagged. I was even told if I wanted a fight it was easier to go attack one of them instead of asking- sounds to me like they are in it for the PvP.

The step up from PvE to proper PvP is a huge step- and many are unable to comprehend the tatics used in PvP. I try on a personal level to teach people these tatics- Elvanae had an idea there could be something on silian similar to the 4 trainers as an incentive and to teach the more advance tatics used.

The reason why there isnt forums keeping track of PvP matches is because whats the point? Betting pools and etc seem a little far fetched and issues with fixing a fight etc etc. There is a tournament apparently being planned however currently the PvP system does not have anything to it- in a game that is driven by reward-basis and level grinding. If this were to change I believe PvP might finally find itself a place in ryzom.

In the arena you can't be sure about your opponent's equipment.

Think of the "fine heavy armor of durability" as the "tribe commander HA". They are the same.

The NPC HA imposes +4 parry... well... The fine HA imposes -1. I don't see a difference :-)

Have fun,
Nuno

Nuno --
Actually there are ways that one can be sure once the people are in the center of the arena. One woujld be to have the referee check a time-stamped screenshot of their inventory and equipment. The timestamp would have to be after they had come to the center of the arena out of trading range with any partner.

Also it would be perfectly possible to have combats where "bring your best equipment" is the rule, or "Naked except for jewels" or whatever.

On the other hand, if PvP means that you cannot trust your opponent in a fair fight, then I *REALLY* want no part in it. I would also hold that if your skill in PvP is totally dependent on your equipment, that there is very little skill there.

Virg -- the issue is that the Devs *never* give out timelines more than a few weeks in the future. Period. So there's no point in asking for that kind of commitment, and if they say that they are looking into it, then there will be an immediate call for a schedule and irritation when it isn't met. As I said, I see no upside for the devs in commenting in this thread. I did not say that the thread was useless; in fact I implied the opposite.

((As for "every single marauder I know..." -- well there's a certain amount of potential for "selection bias" there, but I'll grant that many marauders are in it for the PvP.))

The main point of my suggestion was for the "PvP community" to bring their passion to the attention of the rest of Atys in a way that was *NOT* related to looking for more "game rewards".

Well, that would take the fun out of anything. 20 mins checking screenshots, and making sure the people that just entered the arena can't be in 20m range of the others before beeing checked? Yeah, right :-) I'm also pretty sure a dedicated homin would be able to cheat anyway :D

And ofc, there're the guys who just want to ruin it for everybody. After 20 mins checking screenshots, the last one isn't "clean", and that damn player ran to the group of screened players... Well... we'll restart again, no harm done.

:D

In terms of being reliant on your gear- that is not what I meant. Having the right gear and the ability to know when to use it has a big impact in PvP (eg. changing to dodge weapons when your opponent gets out an axe) Or for example making balanced dodge and parry armor to suit your needs.

All I am after is the implementation of proper PvP rewards. In my opinion it is one of the hardest things to comprehend and be good at in this game. I would just like a little self sufiency to it.

My proposal was intended to answer the i-want-pvp-fun-right-now problem. Everybody there would be wearing the equivalent of the best-of-the-best. And i think that would not upset anyone, pvp adept or not.

Regarding the rewards, i have no ideas, sorry.

Have fun,
Nuno

im in a bit of ahurry so cant read all the recent posts yet but!

there IS an EASY way to verify if someone has no equipment

simply trade them 300 bulk of items, if they accept and it works, they are totally naked

problem solved. i like this i will definitely be up for some rigged gear sparring

if this was already said, oops :D will read later

-edit-

also to prevent someone from easily cheating, change the color or style of the available gear every day/match every few hours etc so you can def. see if someone put on their own stuff, sure sometimes can get by that but really if you are THAT determined to cheat...you probably suck at fighting anyway and will still get beat down :)

300 bulk, i like that... considering every non-marauder needs a packer on site :P

no, seriously... using no or bad equipment pushes ryzom pvp from somewhat balanced to totally unbalanced. just try it, use a few weapons, magic... you'll see.

Casy -- I would be interested in your reasoning on how having "standard (or no) equipment" makes PvP "unbalanced." It would seem to me that it would in fact emphasize real talent in PvP actions vs. simply equipping superior arms, armor and jewels.

Is PvP skill based or equipment based?

Talent, skills, armor, jewels and weapons all work together in a (more or less) balanced matter.

Anyway i wonder why you are so much interested in PvP. If you want to learn more about it i suggest asking someone from your faction to introduce you to it and explain it to you.

I am interested because I am trying to understand the fascination of it. I don't have a faction, or a civilization. I am a confirmed neutral bucking for Ranger status.

My observation on OP battles (group PvP) is that they are largely determined by relative numbers of players on the sides and by certain high-powered in-game equipment. The possibility of introduction of still more high-powered equipment worries me on that count.

I don't PvP at all in game. I don't find it interesting or rewarding. I've looked at all the stanzas and have figured some theoretical ways that they could be used to player advantage in a PvP situation. I probably have missed some, but I have no incentive or desire to learn further.

I do engage in RL consensual full contact PvP (medieval style), and in that, once safety concerns have been met, equipment plays very little role and actual skill is paramount both in single combat and in mass engagements. It seems to me from the stanzas available that something like that should be possible in game, but that is apparently not what is being talked about.

Casy I do not believe I said no or bad equipment, surely it does not all have to be 100% precraft to suit your extravagant tastes ? There are many standard sets that are not too hard to create, that will do quite well. If you have another opinion I simply disagree. I can make "good" armor and weapons and jewels for use but "the best" is not necessary for balance or fun. The fact is not everyone has access to "the best" therefore standard "good" set is my idea.

If you disagree I would not mind a better idea, but I think this is an idea that will encourage many who have previously been hesitant to try, to join and see what it is like.

Oh wait maybe you misunderstood! I simply mean give someone 600 mats so that it verifies that they are not carrying anything at all.... then they can choose from standard items, i am not saying to fight naked or with 300 bulk items.... follow?

Eruv gave us the bloody solution!

Take one of the old pvp islands, which are still there, checked myself before merge.

Introduce an npc in capitals or wherever, who sells 299.99 bulk tp tickets. This will take you to such an island. On the island where you spawn you get a npc who sells gear for free, pvp points, dappers or whatever. This makes sure everyone uses the same stuff. Since tp tickets take bulk, you will not be able to escape with this gear either, without going and getting another 299.99 bulk tp ticket back to mainland!

If I recall there are 5 different islands, so could make one for each grade of gear, for example fine generic gear on one, choice on next etc. That or make it so that the q on the gear will vary. This way you'll limit the levels who will play there, and lvl 50's will get proper pvp as well (as long as no master comes along and nukes without amps, but that would be rude).

This will allow pvpers to pvp without crafting. Not sure how to bring up a meaningful reward from it though, apart from the occasional awesomesauce gear that you can put on npcs. You would probably have to put a stable there, or maybe apartments, so that you won't have to rebuy the awesome gear every time you go to the pvp zones. Not sure if you could add a possibility to have a second apt for homins, since it can't be access to your regular apt, for obvious reasons. I can imagine people could stand to sacrifice a packerslot, but I don't see anyone sacrificing the storage of an apt for pvp. Some storage will be needed on the islands though. Preferably one that only can be accessed on an individual island, so you can create different level or grade-zones.

Gas out.

PvP comes in different forms on this game. OP battles are one form- one I don't really see as pure PvP as it is tainted by politics, numbers etc. There are many 2v2 fights all the way up to 8v8 which take place a fair bit. It is made sure the numbers are even so the outcome of the fight depends entirely on how you fight and react to your opponents.

Having different gear adds another element to this fight. I have nearly 2 full bars of melee stanzas just for pvp. I have designed my weapons to use for different affects. I don't want to be given gear to PvP in- I want to work for it and killing marauders seems a decent way to do so. (From a RP aspect why shouldn't I get rewards from kami/civilisations for killing marauders?)

The PvP point system is in place! Why not use it properly? A PvP island sounds good (it is a really decent idea) but we have a whole world to PvP in- and the tagged system enables this. The devs are already fixing so many things- I don't understand why solutions that require so much effort are necessary when it could be as simple as adding new armour for sale for PvP points. No new armour designs are needed- the NPC armour would work just fine.