English

I didn’t bring this up in universal channel last night because I knew it would get all kinds of reactions. This morning I decided to forget it, but a couple of minutes ago once again there was an unpleasant discussion about English only in Uni chat because someone happened to say Ola. I’m Spanish and I found the comments made offensive but I was more offended by the one player's ignorance than anything else. I bring it to the forum so we can have an ADULT conversation about other languages in universal channel.

There is a small flux of Spanish players joining Ryzom, though a very small one they have yet to find their place in game. Some of us are trying to help them but we need more cooperation and tolerance by the community that likes to police universal chat. Try and understand that these players are new to the game and they need help too. Be mindful that when someone asks a question in another language in universal channel they don’t need to be told English only. They don’t need to be told to go to the French server. What they need is direction to the proper channel where they can find help. The people asking for help in other languages in universal chat do so because they can’t speak English. If you can’t help them then have some patience whiles someone who can reach them and guide them to the proper channel or a private tell. In case you weren’t aware Ryzom is played in five different languages and there aren’t enough servers to fit us all, and Aristotle happens to be the server for Spanish and Russian speaking players. Universal chat is there to help players, let’s try not to make non-English speakers feel like outcasts because they are using Uni chat to find help.

Right now when a player enters game and changes language mode the universal channel rules are translated so they can understand that Uni is a Q&A channel. Players asking players that don’t speak English to speak English in universal channel is senseless when the game is telling them in their language to use Universal channel for Q&A. And not having a GM to monitor the abuse in this channel doesn't help matters either.

Uni chat needs to be more flexible on the language issue. What we should be clamoring is for the WG team to ADD permanent channels in the five languages the game can be played so these players find the help they need, without being belittled.

Players who speak other languages have the same issues English speaking players have when they come to Ryzom, they need answers to questions about the game but can’t find players that speak their language. They are not spamming the channel with nonsense like many already do with announcements like “oh hi I just logged in did you noticed me yet?”. However cute and friendly it seems that kind of chat should not be done in Uni period, otherwise don’t show such comradely and then be assholes to everyone else. The players that speak other languages should be encouraged and supported because they can grow to love the game and subscribe and help their own language speaking community get organized and grow.

A channel for Latino players was created and I think there already is a channel for Russian players. But these channels are not visible to everyone like the universal channel is. You can help by telling the Spanish speaking players to log in to /channel Latinos Unidos (I’m not sure what the address is for the Russian channel). And if there are other channels for players of other languages why not start a list and sticky them on the forum so that we can all help them find their comrades.

Last night a player was looking for some assistance because he was having a hard time disconnecting and having to relog to reset language was frustrating. When he asked in universal channel for the Latino channel he was directed to it, but already there was the comment asking for English only and then it became a joke. It is okay to police the channel from spammers but when policing starts to feel more like bullying and prejudiced then is time to have a discussion and find a way to improve the issue before it gets any worst.

I think we should discuss changing the rules of universal channel, improve the translation of this channel in other languages, and improve players understanding of its use. Or, WG should seriously consider adding five Q&A channels - one for each language Ryzom is available for play.

Sometimes people do go a bit overboard in telling people to stick to english only (myself included) and it is inappropriate to do so for something as simple as saying Ola. Having a conversation in a different language in universe is not something to be done often. It is the english server and most the players speak english. Yes it might make the non english speakers feel a bit uncomfortable but isn't that to be expected if they play on a different language server.

Half the time I don't even know what language somebody is speaking so how am I supposed to direct them to the right channel. I can't use a translator either in that case.

The issue with creating five other universe channels is monitoring those channels. The CSRs speak primarily English. How are they going to know if things are getting out of hand in a channel or if it is being used properly. Yes there isn't much monitoring in universe anyway but sometimes it is necessary.

If a player is asking a question in their own language in universe a player should send them a tell if they can speak that not continue the conversation in uni. A sticky with all the player-made language servers would be a good idea. I could do that in the next few days probably.

If universe was changed to allow other languages as well it would be madness with people speaking 6 different languages and 90%(guesstimate) of the players not understanding half of what would be said. Five channels would get messy as well, but changing the pop up window a bit is also a good idea.

I agree that we don't want them to feel unwelcome, but there's only so much that can/should be done.

Omg, sad if ppl already police on the word 'ola'
If I'm not mistaken when they added Russian and Spanish translations to the game they said there server to be was Aristople.
About not understanding the other languages if somebody says ola or when somebody asks a question in a different language on uni give him some time, if you understand the person send him a pm explaining what to do or even put it in uni so the other ppl that speak the language can follow.
I don't think policing them from the first sentence is good, you can do it when they are looking to have a whole conversation in uni and atleast tell them what channel to join for their language when you do so.

I think it's just ppl's mentality that isn't open to other languages I live in a city frequently visited by Brits,Americans,Germans (not that many) and latly lots of French. The Brits, Americans and French don't even try to speak Dutch they just assume everyone speaks English or French so when they want to ask something they start without excusing them for the language or don't even ask do you speak english/frensh. Germans on the other side will try atleast or will excuse themself for not speaking the language before asking a question.
If I go to Bruge that is visited by ppl from all over the world it's even worse but still most ppl will excuse them for not speaking Dutch and then ask the question they have.
Looking that the country has 3 official languages Dutch/French/German I can understand the French. But I find the British and Americans quite rude when it comes to their stupidity about languages and the not trying to.
Don't know where anymore but did see a graph of most spoken languages the other day and showed: 1 chinese / 2 spansh / 3 english / ...

Now about the uni problem what if ppl that choose a diferent client language auto join an extra channel or maybe better give them under the language option an extra option to join one or multiple different language uni's (for the ppl that want to speak spanish for instance but like to use the english client, or somebody that speaks russian+spanish for instance). Or when that's not possible maybe give ppl choosing the client in a different language a tag like '[SP]' in front of their name when they use universe so they can ask their question in their official supported language in uni and the rest can ignore it that don't understand it.

Speak for yourself. People do speak multiple languages, certainly well enough to direct new players to appropriate language channel. Policing them? You've got to be kidding me. Who's policing your clan's channel? Oh wait ...

What difference does it make if you don't understand what somebody said in Uni? Somebody most likely will and if you can't stand few lines of mistery then that's your problem.

I think we need to be more tolerant of what goes on in Uni.
It is not the English server - it is for English + Russian + Spanish speakers.
No-one expects you to direct them to the right channel if you can't understand their language - leave it to someone who does understand.
There is no issue here - if the CSRs can't monitor what goes on, the players will. It's not a perfect solution but if you think it's OK for players to police the English Uni channel, it should be OK for players to do it in other languages.
So don't tell them off for not using English.

The biggest issue I see so far is the lack of tolerance and that players don’t understand that Arispotle is the dedicated server for Spanish and Russian and English players. The server already covers both British and American English speaking players and whiles they are the majority they still need to have some tolerance and be more mature about this issue. The attitudes I see aren’t very welcoming and frankly shameful. It is for this very reason I made my suggestions.

The channels are already in place, adding a visible Spanish universal channel and a Russian universal channel is what needs to be done in my opinion. These channels should work just like Uni, with the option for players to turn them off. Universal is policed by the players and the CSR’s, we already see the abuse in the English Uni channel and it is often very bias from what I’ve witness. I don’t see any problems with Spanish or Russian players policing their own channel.

The other day we were conversing politics in the Spanish channel and the next we was talking about harvesting and crafting, we also talked about linux and mac users and connection issues, we cover a lot of topics and nobody minds because we can have conversations and help players at the same time. There really is no difference between English Uni and Spanish Uni except the language. And I am so tired of the bigotry I keep seeing in the English Uni channel against these players. There is no tolerance and no patience and from what I see no room for anyone else in Uni but English speakers.

Opening a Spanish Uni and Russian Uni is a good idea and not one so difficult to handle like some players may think. From these communities GW can find bilingual CSR. I may be mistaken but as far as I know CSR only serve one year and then new CSR are recruited from the community by GM’s. And if GM don’t start recruiting multi lingual players then they need to, otherwise why make the game available in French, Russian, English, Spanish, and Germen if they can’t provide adequate support for these players? In order to have these communities grow changes need to be made to help them establish themselves within the server they are assigned to.

I’m not pointing fingers here, and I don’t want Meagon to feel that I am targeting her. I actually like that she tries to keep a balance in Uni chat but I also see those who try to push her buttons when she does. Meagon obviously likes to help, and like she states sometimes she tries and it doesn’t work and sometimes she can’t tell what language players are speaking – I can understand that. My advice is that when you don’t understand then don’t bother and let someone who can step up. Saying English only is senseless because like I already pointed out these players are told the Uni channel is for Q&A in their language when they enter it for the first time. I can see how someone asking a question in Spanish and someone answering in Spanish look like they are having a conversation, obviously they are, but how else can the player get a reply to their question, certainly not by telling them English only.

If a multilingual channel isn’t tolerated, and a visible dedicate Spanish or Russian channels isn’t feasible, then I suggest changing the current message these players see that tells them to ask questions in universal channel and to include one that directs them to the proper channel of their language. I will go as far as suggesting an MOTD message in Uni that provides the addresses to the other channels. When these channels are blatantly obvious to these players the issues we have now will stop. English players won’t have the need to feel they need to defend their precious uni channel from foreigners, because multilingual or foreign language speakers will have no need for thier channel. I personally will be very happy to turn off the English uni and use cult and civ and region and all the other channels to speak to my friends in English, and at the same time help answer questions in a Spanish Uni channel.

I agree, we have these new translations now and Arispotle is the suggested server choice for them. So we should at least have official promotion (motd) for these language channels and allow a few statements/question on uni. We don't need it for french and german, those two have their own servers and french/german players won't join arispotle if they don't speak english.

As far as I can remember the Pop up that appears when you pen the Universe Channel explains that Uni is for Q&A AND That only English should be used. I havent found anyone else from my country - I dont ask for it in Uni using Polish, if I would - I would use englis - because I know english. If I wouldnt - I wouldtry to use a TRANLSLATOR not to break the rules. I can Tolerate if someone says "Hi" or "Are there any more players speaking the same language" - In their own language, But once a full foreign language conversation breaks out on Uni instead of /Tell - thats over the line.

When a spanish player uses spanish mode and enters Uni for the first time in the pop up window there is nothing that says English only.

The fact is that the spanish version of Ryzom still needs alot of work. Another fact is that this server is the home to 3 communities and of 3 different languges. From what I understand ALL CSR primarily speak English and must use translators to communicate. Using a translator isn't breaking the rules, infact if you can use one that makes you more useful to help these other communities. But it isn't expected and neither should it be expected of foreign speakers to use one to communicate in English. There should be visible channels for the FIVE communities already in game no matter how small they happen to be. And finally this isn't about breaking the rules but about having some tolerance with these foreign language speaking players by the community that police English Uni. Because they don't need to be treated as a minority, and much less be told to go to other servers. It's the nasty attitude that offends, the lack of tolerance and not recognizing where the errors and miscommunication comes from.

Here is a screeny of what comes up when playing in Spanish mode and the translation of the message is: Warning! The Universal Channel is designed for players seeking help on the game and for those who provide information. Misuse of this channel will be addressed by GMs.

Hmmm I see... Then maby Implementing a Translator (Like in chat in xlink) could help. It has a simple setting - Translates anything that appears on the chat with Googles Translator using Automatic Language Detection and translates to one desired language.

+1 to your idea.

Please, no. Google translated text is beyond useless. It is so full if mistakes that nobody would be able to understand a thing. So instead of Spanish people speaking Spanish and only a few other Spanish people being able to understand, we'd have Spanish people speaking utterly wrong English and nobody understanding it.

How i remember it went like that:

a) someone said "Ola, nickname, love :*** you and so on"
b) someone said, Uni is for english only.

Then i got into argument that English only is what ToS says. Some people got that wrong thinking i was against using "ola", or merci, et cetera, i tak dalee.

I mean, there's no need to change rules. If someone says Ola or whatever in any language where the point can still be understood for an english speaking person, it's ok. If someone says english only, he's also right. What's the issue?

I did a quick ctrl+F on ryzom CoC/CoC2/ToS and some other things but I can find anywhere where it says universe is english only.
I might have overlooked something and I'm open for somebody to direct me in the right direction of where it says uni is english only.

Another thing is you only get the uni popup one time and if you use '/u' you don't even get the popup about uni rules, i did also make a new toon and tested the english popup and even in there it doesn't tell me to speak english.

So seeing that aristople is the official english/spansish/russian server I can only conclude that spanish and russian is allowed in universe chat if it's for asking questions.

So pls do read the ToS before you say it's writen in there, I've seen ppl say it's in tos or coc so many times before but they haven't even read it themself.

Things I used:
http://www.ryzom.com/en/mmorpg-rpg-mmo-policies.html#legal_codeof conduct
http://app.ryzom.com/app_forum/?page=topic/view/3169/1#1

Yeah I didn't see it in ToS either but back then when it was created Ryzum was played in 3 languges only. The others were added later. I just tested to see what message players get in english mode when they enter uni for the first time and it's the same message I translated from the spanish version. There is nothing there that says English only. However, I have seen GMs state English Only in Uni.

Edit to correct statement.