Is simple math ... the answers are absolute with certain ranges and there's no different way to interpret results differently. More data = better results. I've used this data to predict life cycle costs for roads, treatment plants, construction costs, municipal budgeting, etc. The process is a mandatory question on the engineer's licensing exam. Doing it incorrcrtly and outside accepted standards can not only result in lawsuits, dismissal but loss of licensure.
Simply put, it is accepted science. As I indicated, and as the sampling shows... thos results wull prove to be accurate 95% of the time ... in other words.... 1 out of 20 times, my numbers will be wrong. So no, it in no way implies that your experience does not matter ... it's just that it matters less ... it's will be a less reilable indicator due to the lower probability of it representing the actual failure rate.
If you bet on red 4 times at the roulette table and win 3 times, what odds would you recommend to the casino manager for a bet on red ot black ? How about we meet at a casino and with your 3:1 data set you pay me just 2.5 to 1 for every time I put a $100 bill on black ... say when.
You seem to confuse the terms Possibility and Probability. No, possibility does not = probability. The chances of 10 heads in a row are 1024 to 1
A classic example is as follows:
You measure the time it takes a single job applicant to type a letter at 1,000 locations throughout the US and results vary from 1.5 to 19.5 minutes. The actuall average of the 1,000 is 10.5 minutes. But what is the probability of any subset of people coming out at 10.5 ?
Sampling of 10 people = 7.65 - 13.35
Sampling of 100 people = 9.24 - 11.46
So no, I am not saying that the smaller sampling size doesn't matter, I am saying that it matters less than the more accurate sampling of 100. If byou are betting on probabilities, for budgetary planning, capital project planning. vegas oddsmaking, your odds of "hitting the correct number" are vastly greater with larger sampling sizes.
What constitutes a broken mission ?
a) Kill a mob that doesn't exist. Agreed.
b) Killing a mob that you can not defeat solo. Life's tough
c) Killing a mob that exists that you can't find. Look again.
d) Killing a mob that is part of a spawn containing different level creatures ... and you won't see the one you need until spawn is killed and respawns. Again, life is tough. Success is not guaranteed.
e) Killing a mob that is not present in the current season. This seems unfair but who said life here or in Atys is fair ? I'd prefer it was possible, but I rec'd no guarantee that every mission could be competed.
I would expect that as problem missions are troubleshooted, some of those categories will be given higher priority. I would like it if I could do all those missions ... but I don't make the rules. I generally report all of those categories. I'd reject a "not broken" determination on only the 1st. Id argue the point for last based upon my personal PoV but would accept a decison of the decision makers determined otherwise.
I am a bit puzzled as to the sourve of your expectation that we are somehow entitled to complete all missions. What if mission was "Kill Dai-Den solo". Possible, but I wouldn't invest the T & E to do it. What if one mission popped up "Haha... a Bounty Hunter came by and stole ya mission."
There's an idea ... as each problem is reported, it is replaced with "Bounty Hunter took your mission" message ... and leave it that way until volunteer efforts result in a fix. Is that better ? Nothing in ife is guaranteed, not on earth, not on Atys.
Your position also dictates that replacement system should not exist until all the bugs are eliminated ? That makes no sense:
a) Who are you expecting to find all the problem missions ? How much longer should a good portion of the player base remain 2nd class citizens in order to accomplish this ?
b) Why take the option to do DMs out ? ... no one is forced to do them ? You are free to choose to remain a 2nd class citizen and do NH.
c) Is there any better way to find these problem missions than thru the ticket system ?
To my view, the expecation of perfection is unreasonable. If you demand perfection, don't choose the DM option ... stick with old reliable NH. This is a new feature ... there's going to be bugged missions. How do you deal with the fact that sometimes we're told to collect 5 skulls and one out of 4 kills actually drops one. I once killed 23 mid level bolobis to get the last drop I needed.
The DM interface has errors saying to do an Occ in the wrong region ... so what ? Follow procedure ... submit a ticket . I have asked if you have submitted tickets ... given the lack of response, I'' conclude no until informed otherwise. Well how can anyone fix what they are not aware of ?
Speaking of false equivalencies... creating them is not a response. In order to provide counterpoint to a statement, that statement has to actually have been made. That's simply not happening here, they're being fabricated. No one can't provide a direct quote unless those words were actually uttered. Every example you have given was never stated or implied. hese are imaginary constructs. Counterpoint can not consist of "Let me tell you why these positons you have never taken are wrong".
Never said that "broken is good' ... never said that "things weren't broken" ... never said "travel for its own sake is good" tho the entire tourist industry of the world is based upon just that assumption. See natutal wonders, enjoy new experiences, learn new things. In fact, I clearly stated that I filed tickets for missions that are broken multiple times. How do you reconcile that with the "nothing is broken" claim ?. Has a new game ever been released w/o bugs ?
To get over the inherent bias against all things DM, let's take them out of the equation for a moment. Please confine responses only to words in italicized text without adding wording, positions and meanings that are not there.
1. When I was pursuing tribe fame, in one instance the tribe I was working on was in Upper Bog. I don't spend much time in forest and of all the sub-regions there, I have spent the least time in UB. I did the mission and I get +3 fame, and 259k dappers and now I have a safe haven to escape mobs or go afk in their camp. Please explain how this is "travel for its own sake" with no benefit when I now have +3 fame, more Yubo points, an aggro safe zone and 259,000 dappers ? Not everone may be thrilled about all of them but if none appeal to you,m gotta ask ... why do NH or DMs ?
2. As a result of this travel ... an area I always avoided cause not having spent much time there I died a lot, is now available to me. With increased knowlede and familiarity, I can now effortlessly travel thru the area having discovered safe havens, mob patterns, safe pathways ... now giving me full access to the reqion without repeatedely dying. Rewards = less wasted time having to respawn and start again to travel desitiation (*i.e. Mada boss) , less working off DP ... how can increased options, time saved, access to more resources be considered of no benefit ?
3. As a result of this travel, as I continue other efforts ... I learned I can now access craft mats as well as get to nameds and bosses easier. I picked up several mission mat locations that I had not found in any other region and others that were available easier than in other regions. Again, saved time, easier access to resources is a definitive benefit. When I need a specific mission mat or craft mat ... I'd go to "what I knew" and I'd sit and wait or maybe take 3-4 tries (resulting in death) to get in a position to harvest something . As a result, I can meet goals, that I previously struggled with in shoter times, less T & E and less DP.
4. When taking folks to FH, traveling thru BB, always took the same route ... the same route we trekked in 2004 when I first went to FH. From doing Tribe Missions, I found alternate routes, that are much safer. I now have safe havens where we can run from mobs and get saved by the federales or in tribe camps. Whereas in the past I wouldn't go thru BB w/o a team of 3-4 ...now Im fine doing solo or trekking a new player. I can not fathom how this can not be seen as a tangible benefit.
5. During Anlor Wiin, I skipped a few puzzle pieces because they were in areas just too hard to get to. In EI idie several times and skipped that bone when it popped. This time, as a result of comleting tribe fame missions, I found just approaching in a more roundabout fashion, I could use lakes, ponds, OPs and tribe camps to do the trek safely by shedding aggo at each spot. No you can claim there's no tangible benefit from any of this but the argument is far from convincing.
To address the no benfit to "travel for travel's sake ... Why ever leave lakes ? ... Ever been to Virginia Falls ? Why ? Did you get XP ? Did you get unique mats ? Or was it just nice too look at ?
You have yet to provide one instance of actually being negatively affected by DMs in any measurable way... in what way specifically is your toon worse off since DMs were introduced. Yes, we get it ... you wanted to do 7 missions and you could only do 6. No disagreement there. Now let's talk relevancy. In what measurable way is your toon disadvantaged because of DMs. You're sitting in court, claim your damages. It's like the guy who claims ... "since the accident, I can't play the piano". Before the accident, he couldn't play the piano. Since DMs came about ... what is it that you can not do that you could do before ?
Would your skill level in any area be higher if DMs never existed ?
What resources would you have that you don't have because DMs are here ?
So exactly how are you disadvantaged ? Your perceived damage is that you wasted time and didn't get your just rewards. Prove it. Show us how you got less rewards than you would have gotten w/o DMs. Let's imagine NH actually was gone and we're flies on the wall and the devs are trying to decide which route to take ... fix all the missions, or just give greater rewards ...
a) 8/10 missions work and you get 25 rewards for each
b) 10/10 missions work and you get 20 rewards for each
In both cases, we are attempting 10 missions so T & E is same .... in both cases you getting the same rewards. How are we in any way disadvantaged ? In court of law, you have to prove damages. ... you can't. Completing 6/7 is still giving you more rewards than NH did.
Here's a very real example.... My son once paid 15% over the cost of a reference GFX card for an EVGA card with a custom PCB and 20% factory OC. We went thru 20 support calls over 18 months and 5 RMAs to no avail. They finally sent a next generation reference card with no factory OC. Do we have a case for claiming ... my old card was 15% faster than reference cards .. this one is not. He enjoyed a sense of pride because he was 15% faster than everyone else. Now his card is just run of the mill and he no longer gets the same sense of satisfaction of having something special.
No we can't .. we were guaranteed a certain level of performance and the new reference card is faster than the old fancy smancy card. Case closed. You may get a sense of personal satisfaction by completing 100% of the missions, but the only way you can be "disadvantaged" is by showing you are "getting less".
You do realize that NH is still here right ? I followed the official posts as we went from NH to "no NH" to DM + NH ? It was made clear that the system will be revamped and that NH would remain in place until it's where they want it to be ... well balanced and, hopefully ... eventually, bug free.
1. NH had issues, we were advised that a new system would be incorporated.
2. They put in a new system, everyone complained .. mosty that the unbalance that they enjoyed was gone, also because it had minor quirks.
3. They announced that they would revise and reintroduce the new system while leaving NH in place giving players the option or doing either. You already have exactly what you want.
The other parts not discussed.
1. All the missions that I have encountered that can not be completed are kill missions. Simple Solution - Select "None" for Fight missions, problem solved. Take 7 missions from the other 3 categories.
2. Select the 4 occupations that you do for NH for DMs, that leaves you just 3 missions, greatly reducing the chance of getting an undoable missions.
3. When you talk about 13%, that's just for Loria missions ? ... It's not clear but ***if*** so, when we include all 4 regions .... we're talking 3.25 %
On average we're talking 4 different types of missions...
-I have never had a craft mission fail over the past 18 months I have been pursuing fame.
-I have never had a forage mission fail over the past 18 months I have been pursuing tribe fame.
-I have never had a track, deliver, explore mission fail over the past 18 months I have been pursuing tribe fame.
So if your mission failure rate is 13% ... you're talking the % of kill missions failiing is 52% ... Having done all the tribes in Loria before DMs. And the DMs consisting of faction, nation and by far the majority being tribe missions. I can remember:
- A kipee mission on OC
Simply put, it is accepted science. As I indicated, and as the sampling shows... thos results wull prove to be accurate 95% of the time ... in other words.... 1 out of 20 times, my numbers will be wrong. So no, it in no way implies that your experience does not matter ... it's just that it matters less ... it's will be a less reilable indicator due to the lower probability of it representing the actual failure rate.
If you bet on red 4 times at the roulette table and win 3 times, what odds would you recommend to the casino manager for a bet on red ot black ? How about we meet at a casino and with your 3:1 data set you pay me just 2.5 to 1 for every time I put a $100 bill on black ... say when.
You seem to confuse the terms Possibility and Probability. No, possibility does not = probability. The chances of 10 heads in a row are 1024 to 1
A classic example is as follows:
You measure the time it takes a single job applicant to type a letter at 1,000 locations throughout the US and results vary from 1.5 to 19.5 minutes. The actuall average of the 1,000 is 10.5 minutes. But what is the probability of any subset of people coming out at 10.5 ?
Sampling of 10 people = 7.65 - 13.35
Sampling of 100 people = 9.24 - 11.46
So no, I am not saying that the smaller sampling size doesn't matter, I am saying that it matters less than the more accurate sampling of 100. If byou are betting on probabilities, for budgetary planning, capital project planning. vegas oddsmaking, your odds of "hitting the correct number" are vastly greater with larger sampling sizes.
What constitutes a broken mission ?
a) Kill a mob that doesn't exist. Agreed.
b) Killing a mob that you can not defeat solo. Life's tough
c) Killing a mob that exists that you can't find. Look again.
d) Killing a mob that is part of a spawn containing different level creatures ... and you won't see the one you need until spawn is killed and respawns. Again, life is tough. Success is not guaranteed.
e) Killing a mob that is not present in the current season. This seems unfair but who said life here or in Atys is fair ? I'd prefer it was possible, but I rec'd no guarantee that every mission could be competed.
I would expect that as problem missions are troubleshooted, some of those categories will be given higher priority. I would like it if I could do all those missions ... but I don't make the rules. I generally report all of those categories. I'd reject a "not broken" determination on only the 1st. Id argue the point for last based upon my personal PoV but would accept a decison of the decision makers determined otherwise.
I am a bit puzzled as to the sourve of your expectation that we are somehow entitled to complete all missions. What if mission was "Kill Dai-Den solo". Possible, but I wouldn't invest the T & E to do it. What if one mission popped up "Haha... a Bounty Hunter came by and stole ya mission."
There's an idea ... as each problem is reported, it is replaced with "Bounty Hunter took your mission" message ... and leave it that way until volunteer efforts result in a fix. Is that better ? Nothing in ife is guaranteed, not on earth, not on Atys.
Your position also dictates that replacement system should not exist until all the bugs are eliminated ? That makes no sense:
a) Who are you expecting to find all the problem missions ? How much longer should a good portion of the player base remain 2nd class citizens in order to accomplish this ?
b) Why take the option to do DMs out ? ... no one is forced to do them ? You are free to choose to remain a 2nd class citizen and do NH.
c) Is there any better way to find these problem missions than thru the ticket system ?
To my view, the expecation of perfection is unreasonable. If you demand perfection, don't choose the DM option ... stick with old reliable NH. This is a new feature ... there's going to be bugged missions. How do you deal with the fact that sometimes we're told to collect 5 skulls and one out of 4 kills actually drops one. I once killed 23 mid level bolobis to get the last drop I needed.
The DM interface has errors saying to do an Occ in the wrong region ... so what ? Follow procedure ... submit a ticket . I have asked if you have submitted tickets ... given the lack of response, I'' conclude no until informed otherwise. Well how can anyone fix what they are not aware of ?
Speaking of false equivalencies... creating them is not a response. In order to provide counterpoint to a statement, that statement has to actually have been made. That's simply not happening here, they're being fabricated. No one can't provide a direct quote unless those words were actually uttered. Every example you have given was never stated or implied. hese are imaginary constructs. Counterpoint can not consist of "Let me tell you why these positons you have never taken are wrong".
Never said that "broken is good' ... never said that "things weren't broken" ... never said "travel for its own sake is good" tho the entire tourist industry of the world is based upon just that assumption. See natutal wonders, enjoy new experiences, learn new things. In fact, I clearly stated that I filed tickets for missions that are broken multiple times. How do you reconcile that with the "nothing is broken" claim ?. Has a new game ever been released w/o bugs ?
To get over the inherent bias against all things DM, let's take them out of the equation for a moment. Please confine responses only to words in italicized text without adding wording, positions and meanings that are not there.
1. When I was pursuing tribe fame, in one instance the tribe I was working on was in Upper Bog. I don't spend much time in forest and of all the sub-regions there, I have spent the least time in UB. I did the mission and I get +3 fame, and 259k dappers and now I have a safe haven to escape mobs or go afk in their camp. Please explain how this is "travel for its own sake" with no benefit when I now have +3 fame, more Yubo points, an aggro safe zone and 259,000 dappers ? Not everone may be thrilled about all of them but if none appeal to you,m gotta ask ... why do NH or DMs ?
2. As a result of this travel ... an area I always avoided cause not having spent much time there I died a lot, is now available to me. With increased knowlede and familiarity, I can now effortlessly travel thru the area having discovered safe havens, mob patterns, safe pathways ... now giving me full access to the reqion without repeatedely dying. Rewards = less wasted time having to respawn and start again to travel desitiation (*i.e. Mada boss) , less working off DP ... how can increased options, time saved, access to more resources be considered of no benefit ?
3. As a result of this travel, as I continue other efforts ... I learned I can now access craft mats as well as get to nameds and bosses easier. I picked up several mission mat locations that I had not found in any other region and others that were available easier than in other regions. Again, saved time, easier access to resources is a definitive benefit. When I need a specific mission mat or craft mat ... I'd go to "what I knew" and I'd sit and wait or maybe take 3-4 tries (resulting in death) to get in a position to harvest something . As a result, I can meet goals, that I previously struggled with in shoter times, less T & E and less DP.
4. When taking folks to FH, traveling thru BB, always took the same route ... the same route we trekked in 2004 when I first went to FH. From doing Tribe Missions, I found alternate routes, that are much safer. I now have safe havens where we can run from mobs and get saved by the federales or in tribe camps. Whereas in the past I wouldn't go thru BB w/o a team of 3-4 ...now Im fine doing solo or trekking a new player. I can not fathom how this can not be seen as a tangible benefit.
5. During Anlor Wiin, I skipped a few puzzle pieces because they were in areas just too hard to get to. In EI idie several times and skipped that bone when it popped. This time, as a result of comleting tribe fame missions, I found just approaching in a more roundabout fashion, I could use lakes, ponds, OPs and tribe camps to do the trek safely by shedding aggo at each spot. No you can claim there's no tangible benefit from any of this but the argument is far from convincing.
To address the no benfit to "travel for travel's sake ... Why ever leave lakes ? ... Ever been to Virginia Falls ? Why ? Did you get XP ? Did you get unique mats ? Or was it just nice too look at ?
You have yet to provide one instance of actually being negatively affected by DMs in any measurable way... in what way specifically is your toon worse off since DMs were introduced. Yes, we get it ... you wanted to do 7 missions and you could only do 6. No disagreement there. Now let's talk relevancy. In what measurable way is your toon disadvantaged because of DMs. You're sitting in court, claim your damages. It's like the guy who claims ... "since the accident, I can't play the piano". Before the accident, he couldn't play the piano. Since DMs came about ... what is it that you can not do that you could do before ?
Would your skill level in any area be higher if DMs never existed ?
What resources would you have that you don't have because DMs are here ?
So exactly how are you disadvantaged ? Your perceived damage is that you wasted time and didn't get your just rewards. Prove it. Show us how you got less rewards than you would have gotten w/o DMs. Let's imagine NH actually was gone and we're flies on the wall and the devs are trying to decide which route to take ... fix all the missions, or just give greater rewards ...
a) 8/10 missions work and you get 25 rewards for each
b) 10/10 missions work and you get 20 rewards for each
In both cases, we are attempting 10 missions so T & E is same .... in both cases you getting the same rewards. How are we in any way disadvantaged ? In court of law, you have to prove damages. ... you can't. Completing 6/7 is still giving you more rewards than NH did.
Here's a very real example.... My son once paid 15% over the cost of a reference GFX card for an EVGA card with a custom PCB and 20% factory OC. We went thru 20 support calls over 18 months and 5 RMAs to no avail. They finally sent a next generation reference card with no factory OC. Do we have a case for claiming ... my old card was 15% faster than reference cards .. this one is not. He enjoyed a sense of pride because he was 15% faster than everyone else. Now his card is just run of the mill and he no longer gets the same sense of satisfaction of having something special.
No we can't .. we were guaranteed a certain level of performance and the new reference card is faster than the old fancy smancy card. Case closed. You may get a sense of personal satisfaction by completing 100% of the missions, but the only way you can be "disadvantaged" is by showing you are "getting less".
You do realize that NH is still here right ? I followed the official posts as we went from NH to "no NH" to DM + NH ? It was made clear that the system will be revamped and that NH would remain in place until it's where they want it to be ... well balanced and, hopefully ... eventually, bug free.
1. NH had issues, we were advised that a new system would be incorporated.
2. They put in a new system, everyone complained .. mosty that the unbalance that they enjoyed was gone, also because it had minor quirks.
3. They announced that they would revise and reintroduce the new system while leaving NH in place giving players the option or doing either. You already have exactly what you want.
The other parts not discussed.
1. All the missions that I have encountered that can not be completed are kill missions. Simple Solution - Select "None" for Fight missions, problem solved. Take 7 missions from the other 3 categories.
2. Select the 4 occupations that you do for NH for DMs, that leaves you just 3 missions, greatly reducing the chance of getting an undoable missions.
3. When you talk about 13%, that's just for Loria missions ? ... It's not clear but ***if*** so, when we include all 4 regions .... we're talking 3.25 %
On average we're talking 4 different types of missions...
-I have never had a craft mission fail over the past 18 months I have been pursuing fame.
-I have never had a forage mission fail over the past 18 months I have been pursuing tribe fame.
-I have never had a track, deliver, explore mission fail over the past 18 months I have been pursuing tribe fame.
So if your mission failure rate is 13% ... you're talking the % of kill missions failiing is 52% ... Having done all the tribes in Loria before DMs. And the DMs consisting of faction, nation and by far the majority being tribe missions. I can remember:
- A kipee mission on OC
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