@ Gidget
1. Yes, I have found many missions in Loria that don't work.
-Kill Goo Creatures
-Kill Kidniak
-Kill 230 Kiban
-Kill [Don't remember] Level Kizoar and Kiban ... this one I have been told exists ... but if it's a only one in a spawn and it's dead ... have to kill rest of spawn thing, never gonna find it.
And other missions that aren't practical ... for example killing 4 and 5 star super herbies. I killed a plod in Outlaw Canyon once ... took me 20 minutes. Tried Loria... when I sat down to regen, it had 100% HP by time I stood up. And when running around carting multiple tools, focus and HP mage gear ... I don't have room for 2h weaps, HA, eggs and stuff.
2. I do 2-3 occupations at a time. Takes me about an hour for each ... (except Butcher) to collect 6 days worth of practices. With NH, I would go to bench and practice grades 1 thru 6 in one sitting ... after improving them, I'd walk away with 24 x 6 mats (144) as you can practice each level occ once per day. That's 4 days of NH hand-ins for a bit over an hour's work the 1st day and 2 minutes on the following 3 days.
DM's make it harder. DMs require 10 Q70s / 20 Q60s ... 40 Q20s. No Q10s at this point but that's supposed to be fixed. I hope they also fix the numbers, and get rid of the oddball numbers an make them match. If ya gonna get 18 for 100%, then make the hand ins 9, 18, 27, 36, 45, 54. Or give out 20 for 100% and make the hand ins 10, 20, 30 ....For improved, we'd get + 33% ... Again, no odd numbers ... 33% would give us 6.67 each time... or 20 after 3 tries ... so out of every 3 tries gives us a 1/3 chance of getting a +10 and a 2/3 chance of getting a +5 for same % bonus.
EDIT: I git the numbers wrong from memory ... actual numbers for hand ins are listed here but same thinking applies.
https://app.ryzom.com/app_forum/index.php?page=topic/view/25037/4 5#45
3. I been doing since Day 1 ... did just green ones for 2 days and then no restriction. I have had 1 what I call "Impossible Missions Force" (maybe possible but not worth the T, E & R) happen on about 3 days and 2 of them twice
4. It's not about dapper back in the day versus now. It's not about liking missions ... what I like is variety so things don't get boring. What I like is a thought process for making a decision as opposed to only one option making sense. What I like is balance so everyone is not doing the same danged thing all the time. Ryzom doesn't reward the player with quick twitch finger muscles, it works hard to work best for those who use the muscle between the ears.
5. It appears that I must have not explained my point clearly. It's all about balance... it's all about making an intelligent choice. It's all about making the same rewards accessible to the entire player base, and not favoring particular play styles or mindsets.
In focus beta we spent weeks assigned to various tasks killing things with magic versus melee... the point being ... if one or the other dominated, everyone would focus on the one thing. Everyone would be using a 2H axe ... everyone would be using the same spell.
After release...every weapon did the same thing ... all that changed was looks. Then, a patch gave weapons various different characteristics. An axe did more damage but would have less speed. That now meant no best weapon, but each could be best in individual circumstances. Sometimes, pike form example, the advantages / disadvantages were not immediately apparent. But with the greater reach, you took less damage and you could hold more mobs.
What we had with NH was:
a) Way to get the most fame for your time investment = NH by a huge margin.
b) Way to get the most dapper for your time investment = NH by a huge margin.
c) Way to get the most points / rewards for your time investment = NH by a huge margin.
d) Factioned players saw up to 4 times the rewards as other groups creating an elite class.
So, no ... not about how much you get now versus then ... it's about various path to the goal could be taken then with reasonably equivalent rewards. NH chamged that; NH left us with only a single logical pathway. No other pathway could provide equivalent rewards for the same T & E. You don't lik that factioned players get 4 times the rewards .... but here's where we disagree ... you are OK with NH, even for the neutrals like us, giving ius 4 to 5 times the rewards of any other pathway.
With everyone complaining about "no content", after NH, there was over 11,000 pieces of content that no one was participating in. After a mission oriented Silan ... once NH arrived, those new folks you spoke of were guided by their 'elders' ... "no don't do that do this, never advance your occupations cause you get the same rewards much easier this way".
Now we are rewarded in different ways ...
a) Need fame ... focus on the "Green Missions" (explore / deliver) ... much fame, little dappers.
b) Need dappers, focus on the blue (craft) missions.
c) Need mix of both, do the Purple (Prospsct).
d) The Red (kill) missions are similar to purple but not as much dapper.
But the best thing about the missions, (and I got this doing tribe missions before DMs came along) is I am visiting more areas of Atys ... back in the day, like up until 6 months ago... I avoided BB and EI , HOP, UB ... because they were "problematic" to get around. We all stayed with what we knew cause if you were level 40 in dig, you were told to go to Dyron ... and, back in the day, screwing it up for the higher level players who might get 30-45 minutes a day before KT made digging impossible. Meanwhile all the lower areas the higher level players got no benefit from diggin in were 100% KT.
Now it's as if I was given an expansion pack. I did the grind for lakes dig in EI from 100 - 200 near kami TP and by the time i finished, I was so bored with EI , I never went back except to do NPC bosses. Western EI was a nigtmare so i stayed in my little corner w/ no aggro in 1000 meters. Now I am comfly in all areas of EI only cause completing tribe missions made "pushed me" to go there.
6. But the most important thing about DMs over NH is it treats all player groups equally. No more 4 x the rewards for one group over another. Of course, those who enjoyed the preferential treatament will be disappointed, but as long as we all pay the same subscription and all have to put in equal time and effort, this is fairer.
7. In addition, you are not pidgeon holed into doing things you don't want to do ... don't like harvest missions, exclude them.
a) You can get to 50 fame in about 3 days with NH ... 12 days and you 50-50-50-50. As Joe Pesci said in "My cousin Vinny" ... "I got no more use for this guy"
b) Just leveling my skills, you can make 10 million a month ... after paying for the NPC plans reassembly, again "I have no use for this guy".
c) As for crystals ... I am split on my feelings. yes, it gives you something to do when you have no one to team with ... OTOH, one reason you have no one to team with is cause many folks are off leveling with their alts and crystals. Might was well go play Witcher or Metro if I am going to play alone.
8. Economy ? There is no economy, never was. The only thing I felt had any real damaging effect over all the "corrections" was when the cost and value of everything was reduced post merge ... to no great efefct ... exept the cost of NPC plan restoration remained at 90 million instea dof being reduced propertionately.
It's barter economy and NH didn't change that one bit to my view. What NH did was pigeon hole the entire population into do one thing day after day, week after week, month after month, year after year. It's about resources .... dapper so you can pay expenses, nation points so you can buy consumables. And NH was the single most priftable thing you could to ... nothning else gave you an option that was even 25% as productive on a time and effort investment basis. So everyone did level 1 maybe 2 in two occs and dead ended there.
9. Now instead of 2 occs, plyers realize significant advantage in having 8 ...You will still get about the same amount of crystals with NH as you do with 2occs now. But if you have 8 occs, you get a 20% bonus. If you get to Grade 6, you get more rewards for your time investment than with lower grades ... If you improve the mats, you get even more rewards. Essentially, the more areas of the game you explore, the more rewards you get. Not like NH where there's no incentive to pass Grade 1. NH was the equoivalent of the no show job you got cause because your uncle is a union boss or a politcal appointee :).
In summary ...
DMs = more variety
DMs = eliminate your cult favoritism issues
DMs = greater rewards for greater efforts and accomplishments
DMs = greater exposure to infrequently visited areas
1. Yes, I have found many missions in Loria that don't work.
-Kill Goo Creatures
-Kill Kidniak
-Kill 230 Kiban
-Kill [Don't remember] Level Kizoar and Kiban ... this one I have been told exists ... but if it's a only one in a spawn and it's dead ... have to kill rest of spawn thing, never gonna find it.
And other missions that aren't practical ... for example killing 4 and 5 star super herbies. I killed a plod in Outlaw Canyon once ... took me 20 minutes. Tried Loria... when I sat down to regen, it had 100% HP by time I stood up. And when running around carting multiple tools, focus and HP mage gear ... I don't have room for 2h weaps, HA, eggs and stuff.
2. I do 2-3 occupations at a time. Takes me about an hour for each ... (except Butcher) to collect 6 days worth of practices. With NH, I would go to bench and practice grades 1 thru 6 in one sitting ... after improving them, I'd walk away with 24 x 6 mats (144) as you can practice each level occ once per day. That's 4 days of NH hand-ins for a bit over an hour's work the 1st day and 2 minutes on the following 3 days.
DM's make it harder. DMs require 10 Q70s / 20 Q60s ... 40 Q20s. No Q10s at this point but that's supposed to be fixed. I hope they also fix the numbers, and get rid of the oddball numbers an make them match. If ya gonna get 18 for 100%, then make the hand ins 9, 18, 27, 36, 45, 54. Or give out 20 for 100% and make the hand ins 10, 20, 30 ....For improved, we'd get + 33% ... Again, no odd numbers ... 33% would give us 6.67 each time... or 20 after 3 tries ... so out of every 3 tries gives us a 1/3 chance of getting a +10 and a 2/3 chance of getting a +5 for same % bonus.
EDIT: I git the numbers wrong from memory ... actual numbers for hand ins are listed here but same thinking applies.
https://app.ryzom.com/app_forum/index.php?page=topic/view/25037/4 5#45
3. I been doing since Day 1 ... did just green ones for 2 days and then no restriction. I have had 1 what I call "Impossible Missions Force" (maybe possible but not worth the T, E & R) happen on about 3 days and 2 of them twice
4. It's not about dapper back in the day versus now. It's not about liking missions ... what I like is variety so things don't get boring. What I like is a thought process for making a decision as opposed to only one option making sense. What I like is balance so everyone is not doing the same danged thing all the time. Ryzom doesn't reward the player with quick twitch finger muscles, it works hard to work best for those who use the muscle between the ears.
5. It appears that I must have not explained my point clearly. It's all about balance... it's all about making an intelligent choice. It's all about making the same rewards accessible to the entire player base, and not favoring particular play styles or mindsets.
In focus beta we spent weeks assigned to various tasks killing things with magic versus melee... the point being ... if one or the other dominated, everyone would focus on the one thing. Everyone would be using a 2H axe ... everyone would be using the same spell.
After release...every weapon did the same thing ... all that changed was looks. Then, a patch gave weapons various different characteristics. An axe did more damage but would have less speed. That now meant no best weapon, but each could be best in individual circumstances. Sometimes, pike form example, the advantages / disadvantages were not immediately apparent. But with the greater reach, you took less damage and you could hold more mobs.
What we had with NH was:
a) Way to get the most fame for your time investment = NH by a huge margin.
b) Way to get the most dapper for your time investment = NH by a huge margin.
c) Way to get the most points / rewards for your time investment = NH by a huge margin.
d) Factioned players saw up to 4 times the rewards as other groups creating an elite class.
So, no ... not about how much you get now versus then ... it's about various path to the goal could be taken then with reasonably equivalent rewards. NH chamged that; NH left us with only a single logical pathway. No other pathway could provide equivalent rewards for the same T & E. You don't lik that factioned players get 4 times the rewards .... but here's where we disagree ... you are OK with NH, even for the neutrals like us, giving ius 4 to 5 times the rewards of any other pathway.
With everyone complaining about "no content", after NH, there was over 11,000 pieces of content that no one was participating in. After a mission oriented Silan ... once NH arrived, those new folks you spoke of were guided by their 'elders' ... "no don't do that do this, never advance your occupations cause you get the same rewards much easier this way".
Now we are rewarded in different ways ...
a) Need fame ... focus on the "Green Missions" (explore / deliver) ... much fame, little dappers.
b) Need dappers, focus on the blue (craft) missions.
c) Need mix of both, do the Purple (Prospsct).
d) The Red (kill) missions are similar to purple but not as much dapper.
But the best thing about the missions, (and I got this doing tribe missions before DMs came along) is I am visiting more areas of Atys ... back in the day, like up until 6 months ago... I avoided BB and EI , HOP, UB ... because they were "problematic" to get around. We all stayed with what we knew cause if you were level 40 in dig, you were told to go to Dyron ... and, back in the day, screwing it up for the higher level players who might get 30-45 minutes a day before KT made digging impossible. Meanwhile all the lower areas the higher level players got no benefit from diggin in were 100% KT.
Now it's as if I was given an expansion pack. I did the grind for lakes dig in EI from 100 - 200 near kami TP and by the time i finished, I was so bored with EI , I never went back except to do NPC bosses. Western EI was a nigtmare so i stayed in my little corner w/ no aggro in 1000 meters. Now I am comfly in all areas of EI only cause completing tribe missions made "pushed me" to go there.
6. But the most important thing about DMs over NH is it treats all player groups equally. No more 4 x the rewards for one group over another. Of course, those who enjoyed the preferential treatament will be disappointed, but as long as we all pay the same subscription and all have to put in equal time and effort, this is fairer.
7. In addition, you are not pidgeon holed into doing things you don't want to do ... don't like harvest missions, exclude them.
a) You can get to 50 fame in about 3 days with NH ... 12 days and you 50-50-50-50. As Joe Pesci said in "My cousin Vinny" ... "I got no more use for this guy"
b) Just leveling my skills, you can make 10 million a month ... after paying for the NPC plans reassembly, again "I have no use for this guy".
c) As for crystals ... I am split on my feelings. yes, it gives you something to do when you have no one to team with ... OTOH, one reason you have no one to team with is cause many folks are off leveling with their alts and crystals. Might was well go play Witcher or Metro if I am going to play alone.
8. Economy ? There is no economy, never was. The only thing I felt had any real damaging effect over all the "corrections" was when the cost and value of everything was reduced post merge ... to no great efefct ... exept the cost of NPC plan restoration remained at 90 million instea dof being reduced propertionately.
It's barter economy and NH didn't change that one bit to my view. What NH did was pigeon hole the entire population into do one thing day after day, week after week, month after month, year after year. It's about resources .... dapper so you can pay expenses, nation points so you can buy consumables. And NH was the single most priftable thing you could to ... nothning else gave you an option that was even 25% as productive on a time and effort investment basis. So everyone did level 1 maybe 2 in two occs and dead ended there.
9. Now instead of 2 occs, plyers realize significant advantage in having 8 ...You will still get about the same amount of crystals with NH as you do with 2occs now. But if you have 8 occs, you get a 20% bonus. If you get to Grade 6, you get more rewards for your time investment than with lower grades ... If you improve the mats, you get even more rewards. Essentially, the more areas of the game you explore, the more rewards you get. Not like NH where there's no incentive to pass Grade 1. NH was the equoivalent of the no show job you got cause because your uncle is a union boss or a politcal appointee :).
In summary ...
DMs = more variety
DMs = eliminate your cult favoritism issues
DMs = greater rewards for greater efforts and accomplishments
DMs = greater exposure to infrequently visited areas
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