Well, I guess it's a matter of personal preference. For me, I'd rather MMO's create the ultimate multi-player RPG experience than try to recreate a single player immersion.
I mean, let's take as an example TES and Fallout, which are considered to have the most dynamic open worlds of any single player RPG. What elements make TES worlds so dynamic?
1) You can attack anyone, anytime. Doesn't matter if it's a merchant or a quest giver. Chances are, if it's alive, you can kill it. And they won't be coming back after the fact. Doing this in an MMO is tricky at best, if not downright impossible. How can you kill the blacksmith of the Zorai city if hundreds of other players need to buy their armor from him? How can you kill the welcomer quest giver if all the new players arriving need to take their missions from him? If an MMO allowed you to kill all NPCs anytime you wanted, they'd need to make damn sure those NPCs aren't really needed for the progression of other players. Which means they'd already be redundant anyway.
2) If you clear an area or dungeon of mobs, that's it. You're done. The mobs won't be respawning there anytime in the near future, sometimes never again. Same with bosses. Again, how can you do that in an MMO? Other players need to grind on those mobs, and kill those bosses for loot. The closest you could do in an MMO is if you clear an area of mobs, then maye that spawn of mobs shifts slightly to some other area. Which is fine I suppose, and dynamic enough, but only really useful if you have a purpose for that cleared area, such as player housing.
3) You can complete quests in multiple different ways and the results of your choices have a permanent impact on the world. Did you choose the spare the evil guy or kill him? If you killed him, the village is free, if you didn't he remains the tyrant there. Or whatever. Can't properly do that in an MMO because thousands of other players wil be going through the same quest and choosing different outcomes. ESO attempted to address that with their instanced megaserver technology, basically all the players who choose "outcome X" will go to "instance X" when they're in that village area. Clever tech, but it creates so many other problems (such as not being able to see or interact with your friends and guildies in that area if they chose different outcomes) that it's a bandaid solution at best.
I mean, I could keep giving more examples but I'll stop here. I hope I could get the idea across. GTA online only has 16 players per world for example. Logistics and game objectives are very different from a traditional MMO.
That's why I think the focus on NPCs and PVE in MMO's can only go so far in creating truly free dynamic worlds. I'd rather see the focus shift to player interactions and player-built infra-structure. Give players the world and the tools to build and destroy on it and let them do the rest. Again, just my personal preference.
And yea Everquest Next was one of those games that never saw the light of the day I was talking about =P
I read about the emergent AI system they had, sure. But my point is why spend so much money and resources on an extremely complicated system for AI NPCs that is capable of simulating real choices and needs when you already have thousands of players on that server with their own real choices and needs? Spend that money and resources on player building tools instead and put the focus where it should be: the players.
I mean, let's take as an example TES and Fallout, which are considered to have the most dynamic open worlds of any single player RPG. What elements make TES worlds so dynamic?
1) You can attack anyone, anytime. Doesn't matter if it's a merchant or a quest giver. Chances are, if it's alive, you can kill it. And they won't be coming back after the fact. Doing this in an MMO is tricky at best, if not downright impossible. How can you kill the blacksmith of the Zorai city if hundreds of other players need to buy their armor from him? How can you kill the welcomer quest giver if all the new players arriving need to take their missions from him? If an MMO allowed you to kill all NPCs anytime you wanted, they'd need to make damn sure those NPCs aren't really needed for the progression of other players. Which means they'd already be redundant anyway.
2) If you clear an area or dungeon of mobs, that's it. You're done. The mobs won't be respawning there anytime in the near future, sometimes never again. Same with bosses. Again, how can you do that in an MMO? Other players need to grind on those mobs, and kill those bosses for loot. The closest you could do in an MMO is if you clear an area of mobs, then maye that spawn of mobs shifts slightly to some other area. Which is fine I suppose, and dynamic enough, but only really useful if you have a purpose for that cleared area, such as player housing.
3) You can complete quests in multiple different ways and the results of your choices have a permanent impact on the world. Did you choose the spare the evil guy or kill him? If you killed him, the village is free, if you didn't he remains the tyrant there. Or whatever. Can't properly do that in an MMO because thousands of other players wil be going through the same quest and choosing different outcomes. ESO attempted to address that with their instanced megaserver technology, basically all the players who choose "outcome X" will go to "instance X" when they're in that village area. Clever tech, but it creates so many other problems (such as not being able to see or interact with your friends and guildies in that area if they chose different outcomes) that it's a bandaid solution at best.
I mean, I could keep giving more examples but I'll stop here. I hope I could get the idea across. GTA online only has 16 players per world for example. Logistics and game objectives are very different from a traditional MMO.
That's why I think the focus on NPCs and PVE in MMO's can only go so far in creating truly free dynamic worlds. I'd rather see the focus shift to player interactions and player-built infra-structure. Give players the world and the tools to build and destroy on it and let them do the rest. Again, just my personal preference.
And yea Everquest Next was one of those games that never saw the light of the day I was talking about =P
I read about the emergent AI system they had, sure. But my point is why spend so much money and resources on an extremely complicated system for AI NPCs that is capable of simulating real choices and needs when you already have thousands of players on that server with their own real choices and needs? Spend that money and resources on player building tools instead and put the focus where it should be: the players.
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"We are Kami. We are here to be you. We are many as you are of many minds. We are one as you are one in Ma-Duk."