IDEAS FOR RYZOM


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#16 Multilingual 

Not exactly on topic, but kind of ...

Why would armour/weapons/things in your hand count as bulk in your bag?

If I have dig gear + MA on me, but I'm wearing dig gear and have a pick in my hand, this shouldn't count as bulk because it's not in my bag :)

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Everone has an opinion, and of course are entitled to have one, but others are equally entitled to decide whether they choose to agree or disagree. Acting like a complete Muppet isn't likely going to change minds or win support :)

#17 [en] 

@Kaetemi - I'm glad we can agree on something.

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@Sinvaders - Yes and no. I mean, yes, it does need to be thought of, but we need to be careful to avoid changes that basically negate any changes to mat bulk. Dividing bulk in half while doubling the mat requirements per item will jsut get us back where we are now.

As for your example, given that range weapons are being revamped anyways, it's possible that the bulk of ammo will be altered to suit the new system anyways. Maybe we could also alter the recipes too? Then again, it seems to me that pistols and rifles are already in a decent place. It doesn't take much propellant to make dozens of pistol/rifle rounds IRL, but a round the size of your forearm takes a lot more without even accounting for a warhead with enough explosives to get any appreciable AoE. So if you want to ignore what I said above for Launcher/AL ammo (only) then I would agree; 25cc of volume is 25cc of volume no matter how many vials of oil you use to fill it. If, say, mats go from 0.5 bulk to 0.2 and it takes 10 oil instead of 4 to make a set of three launcher rounds, I won't complain. However, the amount of explosive in one RPG warhead could make hundreds of small-arm rounds, so leave pistol/rifle ammo alone.

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@Bubbason - Because Ryzom!

Seriously though, it makes sense if you look at it from the POV of a programmer. Having one storage area where some items have a simple "Equipped?" flag is simpler to code than shuffling items from pile to pile as items are equipped/dequipped. To my mind, a better question would be, "Is it worth the hassle and risk of a ground-up rewrite to implement?". Altering the bulk of mats is little more than a Search/Replace of a few numbers, but taking equipped items from the bag is a bit more complex.

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Do not assume that you speak for all just because you are the loudest voice; there are many who disagree that simply have no desire to waste words on you.

#18 [en] 

Bubbason
Why would armour/weapons/things in your hand count as bulk in your bag?
Otherwise someone will complain about the annoyance of not being able to unequip their things when overloaded.
Gidget
@Kaetemi - I'm glad we can agree on something
Don't we always? :p

Last edited by Kaetemi (11 months ago)

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Kaetemi

#19 [en] 

Gidget
@Sinvaders - Yes and no. I mean, yes, it does need to be thought of, but we need to be careful to avoid changes that basically negate any changes to mat bulk. Dividing bulk in half while doubling the mat requirements per item will jsut get us back where we are now.

As for your example, given that range weapons are being revamped anyways, it's possible that the bulk of ammo will be altered to suit the new system anyways. Maybe we could also alter the recipes too? Then again, it seems to me that pistols and rifles are already in a decent place. It doesn't take much propellant to make dozens of pistol/rifle rounds IRL, but a round the size of your forearm takes a lot more without even accounting for a warhead with enough explosives to get any appreciable AoE. So if you want to ignore what I said above for Launcher/AL ammo (only) then I would agree; 25cc of volume is 25cc of volume no matter how many vials of oil you use to fill it. If, say, mats go from 0.5 bulk to 0.2 and it takes 10 oil instead of 4 to make a set of three launcher rounds, I won't complain. However, the amount of explosive in one RPG warhead could make hundreds of small-arm rounds, so leave pistol/rifle ammo alone.

I agreed with you. I'm raising this point because it's not yet clear what changed are coming for the ranged weapons. As far as I understood, recipe for ammo will changed (they are adding others stats and getting full dmg will require the use of sup mats somehow).
At the moment and on daily basis (excluding outpost war), riffles and pistol are more powerful than others weapons. I didn't finished yet the riffles branch but at 230+ I already find it very efficient.

To come back on the main topic: increasing storage. I will talk about guild here so it will exclude alone homins on purpose. But why not providing guild activity (some kinds of mission) to improve the guild infrastructure? I'm thinking maybe missions done overtime inside the guild could increase the guild hall capacity. Or training mission for mektoubs than could increase the capacity of the packers (like leveling up the strength of your toubs).
I do think, this kind of activity could make guild members more imply into guilds etc. And this way, it doesn't exclude non-pvp players (as my previous idea do).
(I talk only about guilds because to me Ryzom shouldn't be played on your own corner)
Don't know if it's a false good idea or not but since they introduced daily mission, why not taking it to another level with real improvement for daily life of players ? :)

Last edited by Sinvaders (11 months ago)

#20 [en] 

[quote=Kaetemi]
Bubbason
Why would armour/weapons/things in your hand count as bulk in your bag?
Otherwise someone will complain about the annoyance of not being able to unequip their things when overloaded.

Why would that make a difference?
I mean, if you're daft enough to fill your bag, then try to take off your dig gear and put it 'in your full bag' then surely that's your own fault?

Penalising the entire community by reducing storage, just to compensate for those who can't work out the obvious complexities of a full bag is ... well, how typically Ryzom :)

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Everone has an opinion, and of course are entitled to have one, but others are equally entitled to decide whether they choose to agree or disagree. Acting like a complete Muppet isn't likely going to change minds or win support :)

#21 [en] 

I think for gameplay convenience it's not a good idea.

#22 [en] 

Bubbason
Penalising the entire community by reducing storage, just to compensate for those who can't work out the obvious complexities of a full bag is ... well, how typically Ryzom :)
Not including equipped gear in the bag quota would probably be combined with a reduction of bag quota to compensate. ;)

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Kaetemi

#23 [en] 

@Sinvaders - I think we are tracking, just saying the same thing in different ways. Well, mostly. If max-damage ammo will require Sup mats once they change things then it might be a largely self-solving problem. In any event, I think the mats/ammo ratio for pistol and rifle is not the problem with them.

As for tying storage to guild activity, you might want to take into account the potential problems with trying to "incentivize" guild membership. The first and biggest one that comes to my mind is that some folks would feel railroaded in a way that runs totally contrary to the notion of open-world sandbox that attracts many to Ryzom. If the devs can walk that fine line between incentivizing and railroading then all is well and good, but it's a pretty thin line.

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Do not assume that you speak for all just because you are the loudest voice; there are many who disagree that simply have no desire to waste words on you.

#24 [en] 

Kaetemi
Not including equipped gear in the bag quota would probably be combined with a reduction of bag quota to compensate. ;)

That would most likely be as popular as the April NH patch :)

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Everone has an opinion, and of course are entitled to have one, but others are equally entitled to decide whether they choose to agree or disagree. Acting like a complete Muppet isn't likely going to change minds or win support :)

#25 [en] 

Not exactly on topic, but kind of ...

Why would armour/weapons/things in your hand count as bulk in your bag?

If I have dig gear + MA on me, but I'm wearing dig gear and have a pick in my hand, this shouldn't count as bulk because it's not in my bag :)

If in real life you wear heavy armor or a huge jacket, it clutters you up and weighs you down, it makes sense. You can't put it in your full bag but you can remove it directly and drop it off somewhere else. Besides, in the game there is no such option.
Ah yeah and I forgot : you would also make the lightness even more useless, which is already a useless stat.

Or maybe simply calls to craft more and a counter-proposal to make gear wear out far quicker to make more crafting mandatory for all.

Are you one of the biggest crafter who makes equipment for all Atys on a regular basis ? For those who don't want to join a guild, those who don't know how to dig in Prime Roots ?

But why not providing guild activity (some kinds of mission) to improve the guild infrastructure?

In this case, why not simply finish developing the encyclopedia with a rite that offers the possibility of expanding the storage space of our apartment ?

Last edited by Balkhog (11 months ago)

#26 [en] 

I gave up about encyclopedia a long time ago ... lost any hope to see it finished one day ...

I don't see the ryzom team making the effort to complete it. That is why I never talk about it. (But yes, I do like a lot the encyclopedia ... its current status is just a shame)

#27 [en] 

Guys stop comparing everything with real life it is absolutely irrelevant in a MMORPG fantasy based .. Even more if we talk about gameplay and QoL (Quality of Life for the one in the back)

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#28 [en] 

Balkhog
Are you one of the biggest crafter who makes equipment for all Atys on a regular basis ? For those who don't want to join a guild, those who don't know how to dig in Prime Roots ?
No, but I would be more inclined to master more Craft skills if I had the storage for more than a couple levels worth of mats between too-short craft binges. The storage issue is part of why I haven't.
Revvy
Guys stop comparing everything with real life it is absolutely irrelevant in a MMORPG fantasy based .. Even more if we talk about gameplay and QoL (Quality of Life for the one in the back)

So long as some seek to bring some of the bad parts of RL into Ryzom, RL will be quite relevant. If resources are artificially limited for arbitrary reasons (like inability to store them) and takes far more effort than it should to get meager rewards, then Ryzom is close enough to RL that comparisons will be made... and not flattering ones either. Also, a bit of RL is even less avoidable simply because all of the homins on Atys are controlled by humans in the real world. If the humans find Ryzom no longer fun because it has the sort of problems some folks have IRL and thus no longer serves as any sort of escape, then there will be fewer homins running around.

In any event, what ideas do you ahve for storage? Or are you just here to do some gaslighting, as usual? Seriously, I'm curious what sort of solutions you have in mind.

Last edited by Gidget (10 months ago)

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Do not assume that you speak for all just because you are the loudest voice; there are many who disagree that simply have no desire to waste words on you.

#29 [en] 

Sinvaders

To come back on the main topic: increasing storage. I will talk about guild here so it will exclude alone homins on purpose. But why not providing guild activity (some kinds of mission) to improve the guild infrastructure? I'm thinking maybe missions done overtime inside the guild could increase the guild hall capacity. Or training mission for mektoubs than could increase the capacity of the packers (like leveling up the strength of your toubs).

I could get behind this idea, maybe "Guild Dailies" since we are introducing dailies now. But actually, I was thinking of something a lot simpler, maybe like a 'Rent a Mek,' or two maybe. I have this problem of not being able to hold enough of my equipment. I got stuff, but not everything, I can't even hope to have one nice thing of each thing, let alone ever think of digging mats to make gear, or not to mention either, of trying to make boosted gear where you need a lot of mats. :(
As for renting meks, make them forbidden to take into a war zone because the 'fortunate gubani' (or whoever runs the rentals) will not allow their meks to get killed. Make them stop once you get to a OP war zone and not enter, or something like that. It is also a good dapper sink for us. :) These are just thoughts....

#30 [en] 

++

wow! what a super idea! Rent a mek!! fantastic that would be. I might add that general goods stores (next door to or integrated into therefore needed stables) could be therefore strategically placed along well traveled routes in outback areas to support the weary trapper / excavator also with basic needs articles and with sale/resale possibilities. (that happened in RW in usa in support of the Pony Express in its heyday; such outposts eventually even became core installations sometimes around which new settlements / outposts arose over time) 8))

Please notice, that such would also elegantly answer to objections about transporting or teleporting mek mount or packers between Atys Lands. Thus my own such could remain all or in part as i have them now placed, some in zora, some in other lands, while such rented storage and transport animals would cover my need to have increased storage available with which to gather and accumulate enough mats or loot to actually accomplish more ambitious crafting goals then have thus far been feasible.
Naema
[...]

I was thinking of something a lot simpler, maybe like a 'Rent a Mek,' or two maybe. I have this problem of not being able to hold enough of my equipment. I got stuff, but not everything, I can't even hope to have one nice thing of each thing, let alone ever think of digging mats to make gear, or not to mention either, of trying to make boosted gear where you need a lot of mats. :(
As for renting meks, make them forbidden to take into a war zone because the 'fortunate gubani' (or whoever runs the rentals) will not allow their meks to get killed. Make them stop once you get to a OP war zone and not enter, or something like that. It is also a good dapper sink for us. :) These are just thoughts....
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