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IDEAS FOR RYZOM


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#16 [en] 

Placio
I originally saw this thread as let level 200+ players train better with masters, but maybe I was wrong.
This was the original intent of my idea yes. Not power leveling. One does not need to be a master to powerlevel.

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#17 [en] 

Dullahan
it already takes months of fame grind (ranger rite) before the nerf hammer on NH, now it might take 2-3 months, who the hell has time for that, and how is that fun?

Neutral/Ranger only incentive on +50 to all fame, is free NH rides.. and now that's all *Poof* bye-bye, tulaloo.

tldr; instead of thinking on what to take away next to make it more 'challenging' aka the time sink patch, how about add stuff missions/events/rp events/ooc events (not holiday ones but just out of the blue events) to make the game more fun... oopps my tldr is long too lel.

Frankly, for those of us who where here nefore NH, the NH was an exploit.  Earning fame for nations should bot come at 20 imes the pace oif earning fame for the factions.   They should be the same level of difficulty ... not shoot up to the point wher eya got free rides in 3 days of effort.

I do agree on the Atuys Citizen nerf.   Everybody else got double / quadruple rewards for their contrbutions.... the sole consolation for AC's was the free rides.   Now that was taken away.  As players are free to make game path choices, unless there's going to be multiple subscription levels, no player class should be denied equal access and opportinity.  As each plaeyr canhave  amac of 200 fame.   Set it up that the max stays in place of 36 mats.

Player 1 w/ 100 can get 36 mats worth of rewards in 1 hand in in th eplace they have 100 ... 100 fame is an accomlishment so reward is appropriate.   Assming that's the usual 100-75-25-0 distribution, they gat free rides in the 2 lands thay have 50+ in

Player 2 w/ 50-50-50-50 gets no double bonus.   With 36 mats to hand in they have to visit all 4 NH folks 4 x 9 = 38 ... and they would get the same exact rewards as above ... but have to travel 4 times.   They get free NH rides, but it's going to cost them 4 TPs.

The direction being taken, as stated in the forge meeting forum thread topics that you wil won't be forced to do things "but these changes will make you want to" I don't think stands up.   Making people do what they really don't want to do to enjoy the same IG rewards is not a path that I see leading to sucess.

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#18 [en] 

Fyrosfreddy

So this patch is "the good ol' days" patch then? the time where it failed to hold on to players? where the game got passed through different publishers and still couldn't hold on to players so they had to merge the servers?

sounds legit, this should bring back the old players, and invite newcomers.. Not!

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Bee-Boop Bee-Boop.

#19 [en] 

People didn't left the game because fame was too hard to up/down.

#20 [en] 

Last 3 posts are completely off-topic, make a new thread, folks.

I think the title of this thread is inaccurate, Masters are indeed very useful, for the most part.

Whether they shouldn't nerf XP for other players.. How about excluding a master from the Exp calculation unless he has DP? This would basically imply getting to benefit from the master's participation without a penalty. It allows for some exploiting: e.g. You no longer need crystals to level an affliction or ranged because there can be someone killing the mobs for you. From my perspective it boosts teamwork and cooperation a bit but could also lead to more people soloing everything and having alt armies.

Just my 2 cents.

#21 [en] 

Sinvaders
People didn't left the game because fame was too hard to up/down.

they left because it's a slow grind game without end game content released by the devs

oh wait, I'm wrong, there's the Gubani brothers..

ofc, that's not all.

and you're right, it's off topic.

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Bee-Boop Bee-Boop.

#22 [en] 

Sarpedonia
If someone is level 249 in any skill the group still gets xp.
But once they hit 250 no one gets xp.

I propose removing that "your action is too easy" for the purposes of allowing masters to actually USE the skills they spent long hours/day/weeks working on to help friends.

If in a group the highest level, once they get a new level, the xp drops a bit per kill. I suggest continuing this drop once more for when they get master. Allow the group to still get xp, yet obviously the master gets none as they don't need it.

As is, the current system penalises people for mastering skills.
Not a great way to reward loyal players.

I respectfully disagree.  This is only a problem if you are teamed.  You can always heal / fight / whatever out of team.  If you miss the ability to join Team Chat, set up a new channel (it's easy to do).  Any master should be eager to help others to level up, whether it's your guildies or whoever.

The current system is fine.  Mastering a skill does not mean you cannot use that skill, it simply means that your training is completed.

Last edited by Arfur (8 months ago)

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It's bad luck to be superstitious . . .



Palta e decata, nan nec ilne matala.

When one goes on a journey it is not the scenery that changes, but the traveller

#23 [en] 

Arfur
Sarpedonia
If someone is level 249 in any skill the group still gets xp.
But once they hit 250 no one gets xp.

I propose removing that "your action is too easy" for the purposes of allowing masters to actually USE the skills they spent long hours/day/weeks working on to help friends.

If in a group the highest level, once they get a new level, the xp drops a bit per kill. I suggest continuing this drop once more for when they get master. Allow the group to still get xp, yet obviously the master gets none as they don't need it.

As is, the current system penalises people for mastering skills.
Not a great way to reward loyal players.

I respectfully disagree.  This is only a problem if you are teamed.  You can always heal / fight / whatever out of team.  If you miss the ability to join Team Chat, set up a new channel (it's easy to do).  Any master should be eager to help others to level up, whether it's your guildies or whoever.

The current system is fine.  Mastering a skill does not mean you cannot use that skill, it simply means that your training is completed.


But it would help more if the master nuker are teamed, so not to steal exp out of team (it happens, you don't need to trust me, I know you know)

for instance 2 homins are willing to help nuke for someone leveling his melee, the nukers would steal exp all the time, even if there where 4 melee on the team, those 2 nukers would still get the exp OOT

Edit: yes I know they could stop before they take out half the hp of the mob.

Last edited by Dullahan (8 months ago)

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Bee-Boop Bee-Boop.

#24 [en] 

Dullahan
Arfur
Sarpedonia
If someone is level 249 in any skill the group still gets xp.
But once they hit 250 no one gets xp.

I propose removing that "your action is too easy" for the purposes of allowing masters to actually USE the skills they spent long hours/day/weeks working on to help friends.

If in a group the highest level, once they get a new level, the xp drops a bit per kill. I suggest continuing this drop once more for when they get master. Allow the group to still get xp, yet obviously the master gets none as they don't need it.

As is, the current system penalises people for mastering skills.
Not a great way to reward loyal players.

I respectfully disagree.  This is only a problem if you are teamed.  You can always heal / fight / whatever out of team.  If you miss the ability to join Team Chat, set up a new channel (it's easy to do).  Any master should be eager to help others to level up, whether it's your guildies or whoever.

The current system is fine.  Mastering a skill does not mean you cannot use that skill, it simply means that your training is completed.


But it would help more if the master nuker are teamed, so not to steal exp out of team (it happens, you don't need to trust me, I know you know)

for instance 2 homins are willing to help nuke for someone leveling his melee, the nukers would steal exp all the time, even if there where 4 melee on the team, those 2 nukers would still get the exp OOT

Edit: yes I know they could stop before they take out half the hp of the mob.

Yes normally you would stop so as not to make the kill shot. Having a master skill means having to adjust your technique accordingly. Evolve new ways of doing things that maximise the XP of whoever you are trying to help. I count this as a good thing.

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It's bad luck to be superstitious . . .



Palta e decata, nan nec ilne matala.

When one goes on a journey it is not the scenery that changes, but the traveller

#25 [en] 

Arfur
I respectfully disagree.  This is only a problem if you are teamed.  You can always heal / fight / whatever out of team.  If you miss the ability to join Team Chat, set up a new channel (it's easy to do).  Any master should be eager to help others to level up, whether it's your guildies or whoever.

That sounds to me like you never, ever, ever choose your heal targets with the team list when the screen gets cluttered, monitor the condition of their teammates at >20m range, or use the map to locate people you are playing with. There are MANY more benefits to teaming than simply sharing a chat.

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Do not assume that you speak for all just because you are the loudest voice; there are many who disagree that simply have no desire to waste words on you.

#26 [en] 

Dullahan
So this patch is "the good ol' days" patch then? the time where it failed to hold on to players? where the game got passed through different publishers and still couldn't hold on to players so they had to merge the servers?

sounds legit, this should bring back the old players, and invite newcomers.. Not!

"Leaving game" and "Value of Masters", like it or not are inextricably linked. Cause for many folks, when they have 1, 2, 5 ... or ... xx masters, they have "reached THEIR endgame" and may view continuing as having no value. So if you give mastering value, there is more reason to keep going.

The introduction of New Horizons was a welcome patch as it eliminated the drudgery of long swims and treks. Things many folks immediately didn't like.

a) The rewards were hugely unbalanced effectively eliminating the viability of choosing 11,000 other missions in favor of just 4. It was the equivalent of one weapon being 15 times that of any other.

b) Unlike TPs, it allowed folks to travel to cities they weren't ready to handle .... at least in desert and lakes. To my view, you should be able to get their on your own before any type of quick travel.

c) It favored some faction / player mindset choices at the expense of others.

In Ryzom there are no classes. No race had any advantage over the other. No weapon had any inherent advantage over another. No advantage other than finger actions exists in crafting (XP is a function mats used) one tree versus another. Much effort was placed in the focus beta stage to balance the game with respect to magic versus melee which was way out of balance at this stage. As it was mages were getting significantly more XP per kill versus melee. They balanced it prior to release.

The key to making all the content in a game enjoyed by the most players is "balance". There were 11,000 missions in the game. Some were impossible (i.e. creature did not exist in that region or time was insufficient). Some were impractical (craft 80 launcher ammo)/ But for the most part they were doable. And some weren't worth the T & E required for the reward. But the great majority were worth doing.

Then came NH and while useful for traveling, it became one G-I-A-N-T exploit. No you say ?

"To show just how quick and easy it can be I have taken the time to record my daily routine of the florist occupation grades 1 - 4 "

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=II3kQ7jmMkY

As for the people leaving, do you have evidence that people are leaving the game because an exploit was removed from game. I have been monitoring how many subscribers are playing the game since Day 1. As a game ages, subscriptions drop ... that is a given outside any major revision or change in cost. I joke that most of my levels are in "chat" and this it's a question I always ask and no one ever said they play the game cause it's easy .... Just the opposite.

Also remember that the average age of the player base is over 35. So the adolescent types that are frustrated if they aren't max level in everything in 3 months won't stay in Ryzom.

So as the saying goes ... "let's go to the videotape" ... in this case "the numbers" or number of recurring subscriptions

June 2015 - 1052
June 2016 - 652
June 2017 - 512
June 2018 - 396
May 2019 - NH Patch
June 2019 - 415

The skill level required for most games is a quick finger ... that's not the challenge most folks who play this game are looking for.

Originally all 2H or 1H weapons were the same damage / speed. They changed it so that each weapon had different advantages in different situations. Initially, everyone chose axe cause it put the biggest orange number over their heads. Then folks learned that each weapon had advantages particular to the situation.

In a small team, tanking a boss, I will choose a high parry HA set w/ staff and shield. I could choose a high damage, high speed weapon, but my damage pales next to a mage; so team benefits most if I am just taking the strikes, few of which will actually hit due to the parry ... thereby freeing the mages to spend less time healing and more time hitting for 3k.

Also when tanking plods for example with their "clone" skill, reach is an important factor when you have to hold 3,4,5 ... of them. This is why most long term players will say they are still learning after xx years.

Crafting is far from easy ... that's a HUGE attraction.

Simply put ... folks who want "easy" have short attention spans ... that is not and never has been Ryzom's player base.



[quote=Dullahan

they left because it's a slow grind game without end game content released by the devs

oh wait, I'm wrong, there's the Gubani brothers..[/quote]

Been playing game 15 years and I haven't reached the end of game.

The introduction of New Horizons with the original exploits was itself **new content".[/quote]

Arfur
Yes normally you would stop so as not to make the kill shot. Having a master skill means having to adjust your technique accordingly. Evolve new ways of doing things that maximise the XP of whoever you are trying to help. I count this as a good thing.

Just to clarify, the kill shot is not "a thing". If the OoT folks do 51% of the damage, the team gets 0 XP and also on kill missions, 0 loot mats.

The part getting lost here is that mastering doesn't really get ya much more than a title. Yes, you can overcraft "sister craft trees" at max XP up to 200, but ya can do that at 240 too, albeit at lower success rate.

Not suggesting these specifically ... just a straw man of something that would push the end game further out encourage folks to "complete" groupings besides in skill, one region, one craft

Master Harvest in one reqion, get + [insert number here] Total Focus
Master Harvest in all reqions, get + [insert number here] Total Focus

Swap out Harvest for Magic and all magic and Sap for Focus
Swap out Harvest for Melee and all Melee and Stamina for Focus

Master one branch (i.e. Pike) in one 2H Weaps, get + [insert number here] in success rate in 2H weaps
Master all branches in 2H Weaps, get + [insert number here] in success rate in 2H weaps

Repeat for all major branches

Edited 3 times | Last edited by Fyrosfreddy (7 months ago)

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