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Give Rewards for Multi-Masters Part 1: Fight Skills - IDEAS FOR RYZOM - Ryzom Community ForumHomeGuest

IDEAS FOR RYZOM


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#1 [en] 

Dear all;

since we started the #ROAR movement; and to show that I haven't given up yet; here is the last remaining ideas that I NEED to see implemented in the game.

I am going to start with the Hot Topic that is on everyone's (or should be) minds; multi-masters that is.

I suggest making our efforts worth our time, aside from the joykiller completion-for-completion sake weak argument; by adding benefits to players who master skills in each respective tree.

I don't know the how's and why's behind coding; but I am sure if the benefits are passive; this will not be a big deal (granted the community agrees...Right...)

Give benefits (of the passive kind) to multi-masters. Keep in mind; all the proposed changes are of the Symmetric Kind; since Symmetry shows good design (be it in a scientific theory, game, skills or anyhting) so Symmetrical effects are what I propose.

My suggestions are: For every melee skill mastered give a number of HP (like 50 or something; the number is arbitrary but enter whatever makes sense); or increase parry number (again insert x numerical value) that is cumulative to every combat skill mastered.

Going with the HP increase that would mean that a master of all combat skills gains the not so game breaking (but enough to justify us mastering all combat skills to gain an advantage over someone that has 3 melee masters) : 15x50= 750 HP permanent HP.

Whether the pve community likes it or not (I really am at my wit's end with some of them) the fact of the matter is that A Master of all combat skills can lose (with all things being equal so skill is out of the equation) to a person with 1 melee mastered; giving they get the luck of the draw with the famous Madness bug; or they match up well gear wise.

Effectively: The proposed change does the following:

1) Gives us incentive to master all combat skills. With the added bonus of them actually counting for something.

2) Makes players and new masters experience when they realize the repetitive structure of the grind, that they will be rewarded with something meaningful in comparison to someone that has fewer mastered skills..

3) Will create a MUCH NEEDED equilibrium to the players that have devoted x amount of time doing y and the players having devoted x' amount of time doing y'.

4) WIll make multi-masters something that is prefered in PvE and PvP combat and with a reason; They should be the ones that are preferred simply because they have invested more time in something.(And that's again part of good design and balancing an MMORPG)

5) It will eliminate the OUTRAGEOUS phenomenon of all things being equal a master of all combats LOSING to a one master person...(And yes with the madness bug this happens A LOT).

6) It will make everyone actually strive to gain something from the grind; instead of the grind itself.

As I said; the amount of HP is an arbitrary value; just something that is not too few as to make it meaningless; and not that much as to make it OP.

But all things considered; I sure as hell believe that a master of all combat skills should any day of the week have the advantage in all content over someone with fewer masters... So; Just give us a measly HP increase; give us something to work with and not feel frustrated.

Hope you will support this idea and if you don't; please dont give the same old null arguments...Be contstructive or don't post at all.

Yours,

Star.

Edited 2 times | Last edited by Northstar (2 weeks ago)

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#2 [en] 

I like the idea, but... To be honst, it's like the minimum we can get... I mean, yeah, why not... But that's not what would make people come back and restart grinding.

We need more challenge.

For example: Getting like a raid where you can find different bosses.

( Imagine a map like Dante one, you have some mobs waves, and when you reach the final boss, you have to kill it to drop special material what you can only find there )

We can also imagine it can change.

Idk, sometimes Yubo, sometimes Bodocs, sometimes Kinrey etc...

It's totally random, so, you can get Yubo twice or got it like every 3 mounths.

This system would ask a weekly restart and maybe involve more than one team ( so, basically, a league )

#3 [en] 

This post is doing echo to your, in a few ways
https://app.ryzom.com/app_forum/index.php?page=post/view/189753

On the subject, i totally agree with you, and wish to see this implemented.

Grind for grind, 10€ for that? noway.

#4 [en] 

Copy/Paste from the wonderful presentation by Revvy on the issues from another thread:

"Tis very a little narrow-minded though, but I cannot blame you for that.
If we do expand the choice of decision (and therefore the information available) at hand,
at the same time, we are expanding tactical and strategic opportunities.
Whether by integrating new data, by analysing them; a ways out, and new choices/decision are
available to us, wich is no less called, strategic.
We are human after all, we can do this.

Of course, it adds depth to a system.. far too easy today.
So by changing this, it will certainly become more difficult, but much more interesting!
And maybe people will play to achieve (and be proud of doing it) a real goal, a real mastery of combat;
Without necessarily relying on RNG ( a roll of dice ).

Take the Quake Series, from Id Software; the gameplay is pretty basic in its core
but timing objects and items (like armor or weapons) by head, gives a whole tactical meaning and interest to the game.

Take the DarkSouls Series, fromSoftware; there is a gameplay based on muscle reflex,
parries based on knowledge of the weapon and its timing, and a prediction of movement.
This obviously requires a perfect mastery of the game, and a lot of practice
it also, allows the game to be really intense to play.

This is what we will call: " Skill " ( cf: a gameplay based on skill )
A gameplay based on skill, is a bottomless well of knowledge, you are never done learning and improving.

For me, timing an opponent's aura's; knowing how - and when to use ours,
guessing the last few seconds left on a PowerUps is a very interesting idea.
Wich would make the fightning system even more exciting, and obviously; tactical.


The Pvp on Ryzom is simply a control of resources, praying the RNG dice.
The jewels are not well exploited, and made useless because of a very low level affliction bug;
It also means, that a player with a single mastered skill can beat anyone in the game.
Where is the logic in all this?

Simply, there is no (aka 0, nada, nothing..) skill in the combat system on Ryzom actualy.
You do not aim, you do not learn, you cannot improve yourself infinitely to be the best, or outclass other players.
And the worst;
Is that you cannot achieve the satisfaction of a quest for improvement/inspection/analysis of yourself.
In order to perfectly master an Art, seeking self perfection over the top.

As you can see in other games for example, more.. hmm lets say.. competitive.

Since you cannot do this, you cannot "beat" fighters in Pvp either.
You cannot reach a high threshold through effort and talent, since everyone is equal.
( and that, no matter how many masters you get or how many natural talents/training you do have )

So you will lose 2v1, 3v1 or 4v1 situation, because there is no skill, neither in survival, nor in mastery.
The game is based on an extra number of players to win, and piped dice rolls (RNG/bug).

Basicaly the game restrict yourself.

And that's Ryzom problem, and even in Pve situation.
You finish your game by grinding all your levels for nothing, just for the grind.
Because the game doesn't give you rewards or a goal to be multi-master (and it's even more obvious in Pvp).

But, let us bring the subject back to its source there;

Being able to alter some powerups (aura) when you are under active Pvp flag is a good idea.
And can lead to a lot of gameplay exploitation, interesting strategies, calculations and prediction in combat.

Also;

Drawing a line between the Pve and the Pvp, is not a bad idea at all.
It could even allow the excellent combat system, and the game's mechanisms to be fully exploited and focused.
Competitive, and catchy for players."

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