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Imo it is about the mara faction as a whole - [Edited. You must act as a polite and civilized individual, and be respectful with WinchGate staff. Foul language, insulting, defamatory, obscene, xenophobic or anti-semitic talk is prohibited.] - the argument going that all the pvp lot went mara instead of pvping in civilisations and religions.
As Virg says, he made the thing ages back - cannot get it into game and my money is on "it will never get into game". There is an honesty about deleting mara altogether - genocide disease could do it - like Bones says, instead of having this victimisation

Folks, please. We are sadly messing with Virg's proposal to implement an OOC marauder TP to Almati, and that is not fair. I had my say about (that I would favor a RP marauder TP to Almati instead, and would ask the ET to take care in an upcoming event).

All the rest - from me alike - is off topic, and I apologize to Virg for that.

Could you all agree to cut the thread at #15 ca. into a new one? My idea was naming it "Future of the Marauder Faction", and to move it either here in the ideas forum, or elsewhere.

Well this is an rp game, so all factions are rp.  Anyway, unlike Trytonist, Mara is an implemeted faction.  You posited the idea of finding a Zinuakeen there, not me.  Marauder were left behind in the old lands. Almati is in the old lands.  If Mara found their own way to new lands and built their Zinuakeen there; the idea that mara found Almati as a seperate, and possibly earlier, discovery from other homins is not unreasonable.  No one is asking for a Zinuakeen in almati wood; that would be unfair.  What Virg, and the rest of us, are asking for, is a rp way of getting there to be validated into the Lore.  But until then give us an OOC way that does not involve going to Temples!

Lacuna, when I proposed a zinuakeen, then in the same way as there is a Kara/Kami altar (only it should prolly be in the corner so that the Maras haven't to run less than K/K ;)). Those altars are no normal TP, you cannot buy a ticket.

Sure, marauders from the ancient lands might have discovered Almati - Dante's camp is only 20km or so east of it ;). Yet, in the Lore as well as in all of recorded homin history ((the times since Ryzom has been played)) no appearance of marauders has been observed, and it would be ludicrous to rewrite history only for a marauder teleport.

Mind that during the temple wars, kitin presence was exceptionally strong in Almati, so that K/K were forced to cooperate instead of clashing like in Aelius or Olkern. As the marauders in the ancient lands had and most probably still have to avoid large packs of kitins, it is unlikely that they rushed to that particular region.

And as the first appearance of marauders in the new lands (the stranglers) was after the temple wars and the creation of the Almati base of the rangers, it would be illogical that marauders, even if they had ever been in Almati, could have established a transport from there to the new territories, much less to Hidden Source, where they established themselves relatively late.

I think that a marauder access to Almati would still have to be established, possibly in agreement with the rangers being in control of the center of the territory (there is no reason for them to disagree, btw.). But that should be done in RP fashion. Maybe marauders might "discover" secret installations stemming from the clans in the ancient lands or so .. I leave that to you.

an rp event to "create" a mara tp in almati (easy)

using the system as it is currently (temples to reach almati)
the marauders that want to take part in the event would dig / loot any grade (basic, fine, choice, excl, sup) of a list of given mats (wood, amber, fiber, resin, ligaments, tails, skins, leathers) they would then take their full bag of said mats to almati, find the "hidden" marauder NPC to turn them into. this npc would pay 25 dappers PER MAT (flat rate regardless of Q or grade) to anyone with marauder fame that supplies them with the needed mats. When / if someone that doesn't have marauder fame wanted to help, they would get a reduced dapper payout of 15 dappers per mat (anyone with a single fame that's above -43)
no limit on how many a player can turn in

requirements for this event to complete would be huge (250,000 of each mat) this would give the dev's time to work on this issue while showing everyone they're working on it. anyone that says "mara shouldn't pay the non-mara" here's my answer: when you can get extra help for a reduced rate, they call that "outsourcing" and that just helps your case in 2 ways, it's RP but still will "use" the help of the other civs / religions and cost's the "marauders" less to pay for the work. (mara would pay anyone with fame higher then -43 less because the mara think they are less worthy)

just my two dappers about creating an RP event to "create" a mara tp in almati.

i understand ryzom is an mmorpg, and that the "rpg" part is importaint, but lest face it, if new content is always being held up by "lore verification" we're never going to get anything new. new content can be created and added to the game WITHOUT lore verification, it won't brake ryzom to do it, and the "lore" can be player wrote stories about the "new content" (if ryzom is a game where the players RP can shape and change the game {living up to the promises of the official site about RP}) then there should be NOTHING stopping new content. [Edited. You must act as a polite and civilized individual, and be respectful with WinchGate staff.]

since the merger and the 3 histories, lore is much looser because we can create something and write the "lore" for that, we can tag it with "river of time" to explain that perhaps no homin on "that version" of atys is on "this version" of atys to properly explain it. as far as the lore goes, i get a little upset that everything must revolve around it, i'd like to see a poll on how many people really read the lore at all. (i've still not read any, nor the ryzom bible {and i have a copy} yet i wrote the upper branches stories, and some rp players asked me if i read the bible or some of the lore before writing it. i did not)

lore is fine, but don't use it as a reason to not do something, lore can be wrote about something after, and it will give a better perspective, just because something's happening now, doesn't mean that a reason can't be "found" based on something from the past, the upper branches isn't likely to be made because it's a huge project, but the story can be part of a "4th atys" that was merged in the "river of time". once the door to time travel, parallel universes, and the like, a paradox is destine to happen, and the "river of time" reason given for the 3 different histories that is "official lore" has opened Pandora's Box on using "lore" as any reason not to add things quickly, because it can all be explained via the merger of different parallel universes coming together. we are a sci-fi (science fiction) game, let's use that fact for the better of the game.

i've said my 2 dappers worth, bottom line, the NH ooc tp was removed, mara can use 3 of the 4 temples to go there, and RP was the given reason, which i'm sorry to say, does not provide an "rp" solution (the kami and karavan should hate the mara, after all being mara requires -43 religious fame)

talk

Mais.. pourquoi se buter à mettre l'accès dans le bois? ce serait plus logique que les marauds aient leur entrée par la kitinière, non?

No, that is not logical. The kitin lair has been discovered by the rangers, not the marauders.

parce que il y a plein de couloirs par en dessous où les rangers ne vont pas? ils gardent l'entrée..ils le disent assez souvent.

Daomei, I am by training an ethnohistorian, and I can assure that History, like Lore, is fluid, changing, and dynamic.  Our understanding of the past is always in flux.   Just because marauders were not observed does not mean that means they were not there.  For example, it use to be taken as a concrete fact that Columbus was the first Eurpean to cross the Atlantic.

Nerwane: I would hate when the kitin lair would be stolen from the rangers (I was already deeply frustrated from the hijacking of the rangers event of kitin mounds by conflict happy factions and their ET cronies - I was about to leave the game then, and please, not again). Indeed, rangers not only are guarding the entrance, but are as well patrolling in several parts of the lair, and some of them have the ability to remain undetected and unharrassed by the kitins. So it is doubtful that they have not researched as much as possible of the lair - without finding marauders, there.

In short, I consider marauders showing up in the lair a damn bad idea.

hein? j'ai le pouvoir de faire partir du jeu quelqu'un parce que je propose de mettre un accès aux marauds par la kitiniere? sérieux?

http://app.ryzom.com/app_forum/index.php?page=topic/view/23805/1# 1

No, Nerwane, I do not blame you for those affairs which are finished, fortunately (with the consequence of losing a great event guide). You had nothing to do with. But I think that planting marauders into KL would be a theft of rangers' territory, and not a good idea.

almati woods and the KL might be ranger domain, but rangers do not hate ANYONE on atys, even marauders, rangers protect all homin from the kitin attackers. marauders likewise don't like kitin because of their extended stays in the roots while everyone else fled.

thus the only thing the marauder and rangers have in common is dislike of kitin.

almati and the KL should not be restricted from ANYONE in game, we need to be fair about this, and while the rangers maintain the lair and almati, there's no reason to reject the marauders.

please let's be realistic about this, telling someone they can't enjoy some of the game content because of their alignment/civ/religion/organization is very childish and we're adults, let's try to act like adults.

everyone has the rite to have access to the KL and Almati.
talkirc

A little mention here.

Rangers on Atys are more or less like the Night's Watch in Game of Thrones. The factions are like the noble families in Westeros (and Marauders are included in factions there). The Marauders and the Rangers agree that Kitins are a common enemy of them. The Marauders have their own way of porting on Atys without the help of Karavan and Kamis. The Kamis and the Karavan, in my opinion, should kill them on sight when they see them get close to a temple, not offer them to teleport to Almati. Therefore, if the Marauders are to participate into rangers activities, they should be able to. But they should have a different access to the area. RP wise, it's sensible and logical. If there needs to be an event for it to happen because the lore doesn't say it has happened before, then so be it.

To say that Marauders shouldn't have an access of their own because they should be able to sneak up and do it otherwise and bla bla bla... forget it. The marauder faction should have access to more or less the same tools than the other factions to make their game interesting.

The core of my thoughts on the subject have been expressed already, however I will confess that I am very surprised by the objections I see written here. Most people get the main points -which are that Marauders may have fames opposed to Rangers, but that they aren't actually natural enemies, and that marauders should have access to the same tools as other players without needing to actually go OCC to access those tools.