ИДЕЯ ДЛЯ РИЗОМА

Well I think anyone who has been following Binarabi's thread will already know what this is about.

Essentially let us have two types of guilds within Ryzom; 'normal guilds' and 'aligned guilds'.

A normal guild: In essence anyone of any religion/faction/organisation/etc can join this guild.

An aligned guild: A guild that specifically only accepts alignments of a certain nature (combinations open to discussion).

Aligned guilds should receive some type of benefit for example:
1) Specific GH decorations (eg. A Kami guild can have a Kami alter decoration)
2) Faction point bonus (eg. members of a Fyros guild get an additional multiplier (not too large though) when earning fyros faction points)
3) Members get a specific title

If there is coding work being put into fixing the 'bug' with marauders. Perhaps that work could be put to better use with this?

Way I see it, your proposal, which I agree with, is a reverse of how fame works now. Instead of it being a neutral homin can join any guild but only neutrals can join a neutral guild, it becomes a neutral (or 'normal') guild can accept any alignment of homin.

Might take some programming but I think that's more logical. The current settings don't make sense to me; why as a Fyros Patriot with no religion (i.e. neutral faction) wouldn't I be able to join a guild who supports no civilisation or faction? Guilds are broken imho or at best misnamed; a Guild should be about common goals not common enemies. If you've banded together to fight a common enemy, that's a gang or an army not a guild.

First off, I would suggest not using "normal" to describe the unaligned guilds. The word has connotations that would imply judgemental aspects to its use.

Secondly, since the "guild" is the formative unit of at least two of the National Governments (definitely for Tryker and inplicitly for Matis), there needs to be some guild incentive to align.

I would rather see "free associations" be allowed in the gameplay with no restrictions on membership but also with disadvantages. (Not sure what they would be yet.) Ryzom is based on the idea that every choice has a cost.

Les guildes non alignées sont neutres, c'est simple.
Et ceux qui ne veulent pas être neutres sont dans des guildes de faction, c'est tout aussi simple.

Les avantages et inconvénients sont connus, sans gêner personne à priori ...
Les Neutres peuvent aller dans des guildes de faction, ce qui leur permet en général d'adhérer au rite de faction par la suite.

Pourquoi vouloir créer des situations où des personnes qui passent des rites "ennemis" seraient dans la même guilde ?
Sauf bien sûr à vouloir détruire encore plus tout ce qui peut être un tout petit peu rp dans ce jeu.

Pour conclure, et ce n'est pas la première fois que je le demande, il serait bien que l'anim clarifie une bonne fois tout ce qui concerne le "RP minimum" du jeu.
Quel est la problème à ce qu'il y ait quelques règles minimum sur le jeu, qui ne devrait pas se transformer en strict GP ...

c'est clair que niveau RP c'est déjà pas folichon, tout le monde couchant avec tout le monde, alors n'en rajoutons pas.

@Bittty- perhaps just a 'non-aligned guild' vs 'aligned guild'

@Djaimse and everyone who voted 'no':

Why should a guild be restricted? Can two people of a different religion not be friends?

I am sure the vast majority of you in RL will have friends of different religions and different nationalities.

For the fact that this will mean two people in a guild will fight each other- then let them worry about that. I enjoy fighting my friends. It is not up to you what they should or shouldn't be allowed to do. This will give players the freedom they deserve.

@Azazor- don't post with the setting on english if you are going to type in french...

While I have no fix opinion about the topic, please do not blame those who are not fluid in or comfortable with English but do not want to be read only in their native language section.

Azazor pointed out (somewhat embittered, to my impression) that the level of RP where that stunning, everybody in bed with everybody, that we should not add up to that. (free translation, all mistakes and misunderstandings are mine)

Well that is not my opinion btw. but he has the right to utter it, as well in french.

I have no issues with him posting in french- but I can't hit the translate button if he says he is posting in english (see the great brit flag top right hand corner of his post).

@Azozor: That already happens in peoples play styles, only the guilds restrict to some element. This will not remove everyone from aligned guilds- only some would choose to do this but at least it gives players the flexibility for free choice.

I wonder what will be the next great idea :D

Why not come 10years back to the inital "The saga of Ryzom", with only 2 factions, restricted access to guilds ( like now, no point to open guilds anyways).
Why not 2 shards ? One RP-PVP and one PVE ?

Looks like some just want to ruin the game, just for their comfort...

I voted "no".

Regarding your question of why not Virg, I already explained it in Bina's thread, but let me try to rephrase it:

I think it waters down and dumbs down the allegiance system. It removes one layer of complexity from the game. To me it's like the idea of allowing vendors to sell OP mats. In the same way, I was against that idea because it waters down and dumbs down the OP war system. Players who do not want to align can be neutral. Or if RP doesn't matter to them and they still want the faction TPs, then they can simply join whichever faction regardless, just to guild with their friends.

I don't see the big issue of why a non-RPer simply must be Karavan and nothing else, but still join a Kami guild cause his friends are there. If RP doesn't matter to him, then just re-align to kami to be with his friends. Or vice-versa. Or if he has friends in all factions, he can still team, league and create chat channels to interact with his friends. The game supports that as well.

I don't think a sandmox MMO's freedom is about allowing players to do anything they want, however they want, anytime they want. It is about giving them the freedom to pursue different activities in the order they choose to do so, and develop their toons in their own pace.

If you want OP mats, you can get them. But you must pvp for them. Because that's a part of the pvp system (or trade for them with pvpers, whatever). If you want to RP civ government or get the benefits of civ allegiance, then you must align to a civ and deal with both the benefits and limitations of a civ alignment. If you do not want to deal with the limitations of a civ alignment, then you have the freedom to do so and remain neutral. You are free to choose whatever you want, but each choice has both pros and cons. That's what adds complexity and depth to Ryzom in my opinion. Making everything available in every possible way just waters down the experience.

Actually Maxxye this will make understanding peoples RP stance much much easier. I personally would stay in a marauder-only guild. This idea will make having your guild aligned to a civ/religion/organisation actually mean something. There are too many 'aligned' guilds that if we are honest, aren't really aligned at all.

Riku I do completely understand what you mean however this option simply isn't just available for non-RPers. People have different stances on RP and whilst the so called 'hard-core' roleplayers take a very literal stance on the lore, this isn't representative of all RP. For example, Kami followers are actually supposed to try and recruit Karavan followers- now how can they do this if they don't talk to each other? How can you truly express to someone what the benefits of another religion is to them without first understanding that person?

Being in a guild with someone who follows a different belief does not mean by any means you do not roleplay and in fact, can mean quite the opposite. I wish people would rid themselves of this ridiculous french view-point that goes as follows:
'gasp! you are kami and I am kara! I must never ever speak to you and spend my entire time being an utter ass towards you!'

Rugby is a true sport because players are friends off the field and enemies on the field. That is how I choose to pvp. People should be able to make the same choices for guilds.

Hmm, the only limitation I could think of for a multi-faction guild like this to not destroy the dynamics of the allegiance system and render it obsolete, would be something severe like capping faction fame of its members at 50. That way a multi-faction guild could have karas and kamis together, but their max fame would be 50. Which means they loose access to their PR TPs.

In RP terms, I guess the kamis or the karavan simply wouldn't consider them devout enough to share their higher secrets and powers with them.

Since marauders do not rely on fame for TPs, they would also need to be restricted in a similar way and loose access to all their PR TPs.

@Riku: That completely bypasses the purpose don't you think? The point is for a Kami follower and a Karavan follower to come together under a common banner. Not a 'half kami' and a 'half kara'. Essential this already happens within many players game styles. There is also more unique roleplay paths that can be opened by this idea. For example:

A merchant guild who dig and craft: it would make sense to have different members aligned within different nationalities to ensure good trading wherever they are. (Horrible example but one none-the-less)

A spin-off ranger guild. Homins united under one banner, regardless of allegiance, to kill kitins.
(I am sure players can use this for much better ideas- the point is this opens up a different playstyle rather than the monotonous one-religion one-civ policy)

This won't destroy the dynamics of the allegiance system if proper benefits are put in place to offer advantages to a guild being aligned- did you like any of my proposals?

@Daomei: Sorry you are correct and I should have defined further, not my intention to brand all French players with that remark. It is a viewpoint I often seen within French players but not representative of all French players. I have seen this trend as well of a more.. relaxed/understanding style- partly mediated by talks between Syndicate and CSN.