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#250 [en] 

Kaetemi
I have a hard time understanding the principle of taking people out of the MMO

That's the dumbest argument against community projects ever, and this sort of closed minded thinking is why Ryzom will never recover. Adding more target markets does not take away from your existing niche target market. Growing the community does not shrink it.

It would tho, any ryzom player playing another game is taken away from playing ryzom.
Anyone buying the board game who isn't an existing ryzom player and decides to give ryzom a try would be an addition true.
A board game set outside of the game would always primarily target board game players and potential new ryzom players secondary.
No need to be condescending either.

Last edited by Magez (3 years ago)

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#251 [en] 

Magez
It would tho, any ryzom player playing another game is taken away from playing ryzom.

Look at the resurgence of CP2020 when Cyberpunk 2077 came out and you'll see how wrong that is. It's a little different there since CP2077 is not an MMO so many peopel will stop playing after beating it a few times, but my point that it's not a zero-sum equation remains.

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Do not assume that you speak for all just because you are the loudest voice; there are many who disagree that simply have no desire to waste words on you.

#252 [en] 

Gidget
Magez
It would tho, any ryzom player playing another game is taken away from playing ryzom.

Look at the resurgence of CP2020 when Cyberpunk 2077 came out and you'll see how wrong that is. It's a little different there since CP2077 is not an MMO so many peopel will stop playing after beating it a few times, but my point that it's not a zero-sum equation remains.

I get what you mean, but what i mean is time cannot be spend on both at the same time, spending those 1-2 hours on the board game are 1-2 hours that you are not present/active/engaged into ryzom.
Active playerbase optics is already a problem in ryzom, when 1 person leaves a large crowd it goes unnoticed, when 1 person leaves small group it will.
With your Cyberpunk example its doubtful 100% of cp2020 players that tried cp2077 did all return, of course a themed board game is very different from an mmo, not like going from fps to fps, but it remains that players time will be split regardless if they return.

Regarding the board game itself, i understand the 'fun' but not the benefit of it, the splitting of players activity/time aside, dev-time and resources spend there could have been spend on the main attraction, i also fail to see how it will attract new players besides circles of friends that likely would have already mentioned ryzom if there was interest among them (i hope), in the case of marketing i have doubts and raise the question why marketing ryzom isn't done more in stead and in the case marketing ryzom is already exhausted i fail to see why the board game would then raise new players in its place.

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#253 [en] 

Magez
but what i mean is time cannot be spend on both at the same time, spending those 1-2 hours on the board game are 1-2 hours that you are not present/active/engaged into ryzom

***DEL***

Against the CoC again.

Edited 2 times | Last edited by Tykus (3 years ago)

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Kaetemi

#254 [en] 

Magez
dev-time and resources spend there could have been spend on the main attraction

***DEL*** irrelevant.

Edited 3 times | Last edited by Tykus (3 years ago)

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Kaetemi

#255 [en] 

Magez
Regarding the board game itself, i understand the 'fun' but not the benefit of it, the splitting of players activity/time aside, dev-time and resources spend there could have been spend on the main attraction, i also fail to see how it will attract new players besides circles of friends that likely would have already mentioned ryzom if there was interest among them (i hope), in the case of marketing i have doubts and raise the question why marketing ryzom isn't done more in stead and in the case marketing ryzom is already exhausted i fail to see why the board game would then raise new players in its place.

The person behind this tabletop rpg project is already active in the Lore Team. He is not a developer of the game. So his time wouldn't have been spent on development. Working on a tabletop rpg is a good continuation of the lorist work: it will use the existing lore and extend it.
It is NOT a marketing project too, it's a tabletop rpg that a passionate is making and wants to share it with the community. You are not interested in it, fair enough it's your right so just pass by it won't change anything for you at all.

PS: Ryzom is claiming to have a strong "role-playing" community and looking at feedbacks this tabletop rpg project is receiving tells me it's a false statement.

#256 [en] 

Sinvaders
The person behind this tabletop rpg project is already active in the Lore Team. He is not a developer of the game. So his time wouldn't have been spent on development. Working on a tabletop rpg is a good continuation of the lorist work: it will use the existing lore and extend it.
It is NOT a marketing project too, it's a tabletop rpg that a passionate is making and wants to share it with the community.

Then it should have been posted about in here: YOUR CREATIONS & GUIDES

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#257 Multilingual 

Multilingual | [English] | Français

Ryzom Forge meeting (December 6th 2021)


Date: monday, December 6th, 20:30 UTC (21:30 CET)

Meeting places:
  • Atys, on the public forge channel
or
  • Ryzom Chat, channel #pub-forge-xx (exhttps://chat.ryzom.com/channel/pub-forge-en


Duration: 1.5 hour

Participants: all Ryzom players wishing to join.

Nature: informative, questions & answers and feedback meeting.Topic: Added, in test and ready to be tested projects.
Agenda
  • Update on recent crashes
  • Feedback on the Client's beta tests
  • Feedback on Boss refactoring
  • Progress on OP refactoring (GvG)

#258 Multilingual 

Multilingual | English | [Français]

Compte-Rendu de la réunion de Ryzom Forge – 6 décembre 2021

1 - Point sur les récents plantages

Ulukyn (RT) – 20:36 UTC
Nous allons parler un peu des récents soucis du serveur, il y en a eu plusieurs.
Le premier souci, le plus critique, était assez particulier et pouvais faire planter n'importe quel services de Ryzom. En effet, un serveur Ryzom se compose de nombreux services qui gèrent aspect un aspect du jeu : l'EGS qui gère les entités (PNJ, créatures, actions, etc…), l'IOS gère lui les textes et les chats et d'autres services plus petits mais dont le rôle est également important. Or le bogue pouvait se produire dans un de ces services et jusqu'à 2-3 fois par jour, ce qui en fonction du service qui plantait pouvais provoquer des réactions en chaîne (et donc un serveur qui plante totalement). La raison du crash est un peu technique (je pourrais donner plus de détails si besoin) mais un correctif a été appliqué et depuis lors aucun des services n'a planté à cause de ce bogue.
Un autre bogue a pu enfin être corrigé. C'est l'un des plus vieux connus dans le jeu. Nous nous doutions qu'il venait des missions et nous avions l'intuition qu'il ne survenait qu'avec des personnages revenant en jeu après une longue absence. Nous avons pu examiner ce bogue car nous l'avons sans le vouloir provoqué en déplaçant les métiers dans la Kitinière. Cette manœuvre, en effet, a provoqué eneffet, à notre insu, la modification des alias (numéros d'identification sauvegardés dans le fichier du personnage conservé par le serveur) des missions concernées. Or, si une mission change d'alias et qu'un joueur a conservé l'ancien alias dans la sauvegarde d'un personnage sur sa propre machine, le serveur plantera dès le chargement du personnage en question. Car les alias n'ont pas à l'origine été conçus comme susceptibles de changer... nul n'avait prévu que certaines missions seraient déplacées d'un continent à l'autre. Pour finir, ce diagnostic a permis de plus facilement trouver et corriger le bogue et au malheureux joueur qui faisait planter le serveur à chacune de ses tentatives de connexion d'enfin se connecter sans anicroche.
Un troisième bogue a été identifié dans l'IOS, il se produit assez rarement. Nous avons fait l'hypothèse qu'il survenait lorsque'un message était envoyé par le serveur sur un canal de discussion dynamique, au moment même ou un des joueurs se déconnecte et avons ajouté plusieurs vérifications permettant d'aviter cette conjonction. Pour le moment pas de nouveau plantage constaté. À surveiller cependant.
Enfin, les derniers bogues (qui provoquent des ralentissements et retardent énormément l'envoi des messages) se produisent quand le SU plante (SU = Shard Unifier , service surtout utile quand plusieurs serveurs tournent – tels Aniro, Arispotle et Leanon – ou quand des sessions Ring sont actives). Nous en avons déjà corrigé un, un autre est en cours de correction. Nous allons renforcer la partie du code du SU gérant l'écriture en base de données.
Voilà pour les informations sur les récents plantages. Y a-t-il des questions ?

Q : Est-ce que c'est l'un de ces bogues qui causait les mélanges des canaux du chat ? Et, du coup, est-ce que ça veut dire que ce mélange ne se produira plus ?
R :
Oui, le premier décrit ci-dessus. Et non, le mélange de canaux ne se produira plus.

2 - Retours sur les tests bêta du client

Ulukyn (RT) – 21:02 UTC
Voir forum.
Nous avons besoin d'un maximum de retours, car le délai d'application du prochain patch en dépend : plus rapidement nous validerons le client bêta, plus rapidement nous patcherons les nouveautés.
Donc, y a-t-il des gens qui ont pu jouer régulièrement avec le client bêta ?

Q : Le client bêta, est-ce le lanceur RyZtart ?
R :
Non, RyZtart permet simplement d'activer le jeu en mode bêta sur le serveur Atys (et non sur un des serveurs de test). Ce qui permet de tester « en vraie grandeur » le prochain patch du client. Il est recommandé, toutefois, de sauvegarder le répertoire save/ avant de tester.

Q : Pour moi, les titres ne fonctionnent pas, pas plus que le son.
R :
Les titres sont en train d'être totalement recodés dans une interface plus simple et plus moderne. Ils seront donc compatibles avec le nouveau client lors du prochain patch. S'agissant du son, c'est en cours : nous vous recontacterons au besoin.

Q : Votre recommandation de sauvegarde préalable de save/ est ce qui m'a fait reculer jusqu'alors. Faut-il vraiment sauvegarder save/ avant chaque session de jeu en mode bêta ?
R :
En fait, il faudrait toujours faire des sauvegardes, mais c'est plus par précaution qu'autre chose. Pour le moment le seul bogue qui a posé problème c'est la remise à zéro imprévue de l'interface qui survient en cas de bascule fréquente entre client normal et client bêta : sans sauvegarde, le joueur se trouve alors contraint de repositionner à sont goût toutes les fenêtres. Mais jusqu'ici, pas de problème avec les macros, les drapeaux-repères ou autres, juste un bogue signalé et en cours de vérification concernant les groupes d'amis (vous serez informés s'il se confirme).
Cela dit, si RyZtart créait automatiquement un zip du dossier save/ à chaque activation/désactivation du mode bêta, cela aiderait probablement avoir plus de testeurs…


Q : Le lanceur RyZtart devrait aussi être davantage mis en avant (beaucoup de joueurs ne lisent pas les annonces au forum). Un rappel une fois par jour dans le canal Univers, du type « Veuillez vérifier RyZtart et le client bêta » peut-être ?
R :
Nous allons y réfléchir.

3 - Retours sur la refonte des Rois

Ulukyn (RT) – 21:23 UTC
See forum.
Quels sont vos retours, en particulier sur le nouvel algorithme d'apparition des Rois ?
Nous souhaitons en effet savoir si son activation dans toutes les régions d'Atys est désormais possible ou s'il nécessite encore des réglages.

Q : Certains disent qu'aucun Roi n'apparaît plus dans les Dunes Sauvages. Qu'en est-il ?
R :
Nous n'avons repéré aucun bogue jusqu'alors, au moins en épluchant les logs.
(trois minutes passent en silence…)[/i]
Pas d'autres remarques… Nous pouvons donc prévoir un passage au nouveau système pour bientôt. Ce qui permettra de pouvoir avancer sur de nouvelles étapes du projet.[/i]

4 - Avancement de la refonte des avant-postes

Ulukyn & Tykus (RT) – 21:30 UTC
Le projet est plutôt bien avancé.
Nous menons les derniers tests alpha et ceux sur les serveurs de tests (Yubo & Gingo) devraient démarrer bientôt. Pour le moment ils portent sur de nouveaux avant-postes en mode GvG dans les zones 50 et nous permettront de déterminer si le réglage des PNJ est bon (il est à son minimum, mais combattre simultanément une guilde et des PNJ peut être un défi un peu trop difficile).
Pendant ce test du GvG, nous avancerons sur le reste du projet. Certaines modifications déjà prêtes comme la réduction à 1h de la durée des batailles et la baisse du coût des attaques, pourraient être mises en place rapidement. La rotation des matières premières et la prise des avant-postes par des tribus hostiles de PNJ viendraient alors dans une phase ultérieure de développement du projet.
Nous sommes convenus de donner un coup d'accélérateur au projet durant les deux mois à venir.

Q : Est-ce que, comme pour une attaque classique, les PNJ attaquants devront combattre aussi les PNJ de l'avant-poste attaqué ? ?
R :
Oui.

Q : Est-ce que, à terme, TOUTES les batailles d'avant-postes devront être disputées uniquement en GvG ? ?
R :
Pas du tout. Les batailles resteront comme maintenant, nous ajouterons simplement une option d'attaque GvG, qui sera limitée dans son utilisation. De plus, les batailles pour les avant-postes au Nexus demeureront en GvE. Les avant-postes offriront donc un plus large éventail de possibilités.

Q1 : N'est-il pas à craindre que certains de ces changements ne rendent difficile à notre guilde de conserver les nombreux avant-postes qu'elle possède depuis plusieurs années ?
Q2 : Notre guilde a possédé un avant-poste de niveau 200 pendant quelques semaines et la production de MP Q250 était… là, mais très faible. Pour les AP de plus bas niveau, ce sera pire et encore moins attractif, je pense. Donc, y aura-t-il du changement dans la production des avant-postes ? Par exemple des matières premières de meilleure qualité pour un AP de niveau 50 ?
R :
Oui, c'est prévu. Les taux de production ne seront plus du tout les mêmes, mais un AP 50 pourra produire des MP Q250 (a plus faible quantité qu'un AP 250 évidemment). Et un AP 250 pourra aussi se retrouver à ne produire que des MP Q50 (un filon d'exploitation appauvri). Ce qui fait que (et pour répondre à la première question) conserver son avant-poste n'aura pas le même intérêt qu'actuellement : il sera bien plus profitable d'en changer.

Q : N'est-il pas à craindre que, à la longue, seuls les plus riches puissent se le permettre ? Qu'à la longue, beaucoup d'AP ne soient jamais attaqués, donc laissés en possession de PNJ inutiles à la vie du jeu ?
R :
Comme dit plus haut, le coût de conquête des avant-postes, va drastiquement baisser et, de plus, il sera variable en fonction du mode de conquête (GvE, GVG ou FvF).

Q : Y aura-t-il d'autres productions que celles actuelles sur ces nouveaux avant-postes, qui rendraient leur possession plus intéressante ?
R :
Oui. Mais le groupe de travail en charge du projet confirme sa volonté première : ces nouvelles productions ajoutant de la valeur à la possession des avant-postes ne seront mises en place qu'une fois la refonte de la mécanique des batailles achevée. Ainsi chacun pourra en profiter, quels que soient son type de PvP préféré et l'effort qu'il est en mesure de fournir.

La réunion est close à 22:17 UTC

Edited 5 times | Last edited by Nilstilar (3 years ago) | Reason: Typos

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#259 [en] 

***DEL***

Against the CoC, see: https://en.wiki.ryzom.com/wiki/Ryzom_Code_of_Conduct


I.2. 
Slander or rumour about a Ryzom Team member or Winch Gate

(Major/Minor offence: depending on the degree, the Support Team will decide on each case)
Spreading rumours, false accusations or lies against a member of the Ryzom Team or against Winch Gate, in order to harm them or their reputation or honour, is strictly prohibited.The Support team reserves the right to make appropriate decisions based on the seriousness of the facts.


Lol. What a load of bullshit. No criticism of Winch Gate allowed? You're not gonna keep much goodwill from volunteers, open source contributers, and other community projects, with this attitude.

Edited 3 times | Last edited by Kaetemi (3 years ago)

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Kaetemi

#260 Multilingual 

Multilingual | [English] | Français

Ryzom Forge meeting (January 3th 2022)


Date: monday, January 3th, 20:30 UTC (21:30 CET)

Meeting places:
  • Atys, on the public forge channel
or


Duration: 1.5 hour

Participants: all Ryzom players wishing to join.

Nature: informative, questions & answers and feedback meeting.Topic: Added, in test and ready to be tested projects.
Agenda
  • Update on dev tools
  • January patches presentation
  • Silan refactoring
  • Boss refactoring
  • OP refactoring

#261 Multilingual 

Multilingual | [English] | Français

Ryzom Forge meeting report –January 3, 2022

1 - Report on dev tools

Ulukyn (RT) – 20:38 UTC
I'm going to come back to the year 2021, which has been the year of consolidation if you will.

We have indeed updated quite a few things, on the one hand the servers, the webIG and the client code (with the merging of the code of Ryzom Core 4), but also the compilation process which is now based on Visual C++ 2019 for Windows. In addition a tool, Hunter, has been implemented by Nimetu (RT) to compile the whole more easily.

Beyond the tools, the past year has also seen the developer team update its way of working: we now use gitlab more for bugs, communication and patch management and we are very satisfied with it... Wondering why we didn't do it earlier! There is one last thing to do: joining our server and data client repositories with the ryzom-core repository, so that the development process will be even easier.

We have also worked on enriching our collection of generic or model-based systems.This is the case, for example, of the "shops" which are increasingly (and will be in the future massively) used to make items or services available in game (for example, purchases in Elyps, whether from Nations merchants, grooms or Allegory carvers NPCs). This is also the case for the Lessons, which are the basis of the information transmitted to players in-game, as well as for the Encyclopedia window (ctrl+E), which includes the Daily Missions, the Storyline, the future tutorial and, recently, the titles, all of which are (or will be) based on the same model.

As a result, we have (and will have) fewer systems to maintain, thus fewer bugs, and we will be able to concentrate our efforts on three main tasks. Namely:
• completion of the three refactoring projects (Silan, Bosses, Outposts) ;
• Storyline's ongoing and the addition of content that has yet to be completed (e.g. Supreme Tokens);
• bugs' fixing and improvement of the client (by the way, the year 2022 will start with a patch – currently in test – illustrating this point).

2 - January patches presentation

Ariald (RT) – 20:58 UTC
As Ulukyn mentioned, one of our goals for 2022 is to improve the player experience through fixing bugs or bettering the client. The first patch of January will do exactly this.

The first change we made was to the system for trading between player characters. More generally, we've tried to improve the process of item trading, because it's not the best at the moment. In addition to changing and simplifying the layout of the trade window, we added two more slots for items. It was mainly the exchanges of jewel sets that led us to this last change.

Another change we've made to the player trade window is the ability to drag and drop items into the window from all of your inventories. This way, if you want to trade items carried by your Zig, you won't have to transfer them to your bag first, thus interrupting the trade to complete it later. Note: In order not to clutter up the item selection window, this one won't show you items from other inventories and this function will only operate by drag and drop.

The final change to the trade window presented to each player is the addition of item bulk and weight indicators. In fact, a small indicator (similar to the one in the upper right corner of your inventories) will be displayed next to both offers, which will show the weight and bulk of the items given and received. All this in the hope of making the exchanges a little more fluid.

Then, stacking of items. Anyone who has fought in PvP knows what it feels like to have an inventory cluttered with crystallized spells. From now on, crystallized spells of the same stanza (or identical stanza) will automatically stack in the inventory where they are stored. As the same clutter currently occurs in the bag of working crafters, identical items produced will now automatically stack in the inventory.

Any questions so far?

Q: Will it be possible to choose the inventory where the traded items end up? For example, to transfer a full stack of materials carried by my packer to the packer of my exchanging partner?
A:
Currently that is not possible, but I will keep it in mind.

Q: The "true" Rangers do not allow themselves PvP. Why, then, is there a merchant in Almati Wood who is paid in PvP points? (On the other hand, keeping the possibility of acquiring the robe and the shield would be nice).
A:
[iThis is a question we are evaluating, I agree with you that it is not ideal. The patch will not change that however.[/i]

Q: Maybe we could turn these PvP points into "PvK" points that could be earned by repelling kitin invasions?
A:
Maybe, yes. I take note.

Ariald (RT) – 21:27 UTC
Let's move on to fixes.
I have to say that this patch is quite big, so I'm leaving out some small details. You'll get the surprise when the patchnote will be released!

We have a lot of fixes in this patch, especially concerning the Zigs:
• fix of the bug that gave them the wrong status when they were hosted in bags;
• addition of their inventories as tabs in the commercial windows of merchant NPCs;
• addition of the ability to transfer items directly from their inventory to your apartment's and guild hall's inventory;
• fixed the malfunction of locking/unlocking items in their inventory.

By the way, the lock status of items will now be displayed in your apartment and guild hall inventory.

Any questions?

Q: Will we still be able to store large numbers of sap crystals on the Zigs?
A:
Yes, that does not change.

Q: What about the bug that makes the inventory window of a Zig vanish when you take it out of your bag (it happens sometimes when the bag exit is activated by macro)?
A:
Interesting. I was not aware of this bug. I will investigate and maybe get in touch with you later so we can set this up on gitlab.

Q: Does the addition of Zigs to the trade windows of merchant NPCs mean that we will now be able to buy them?
A:
Ah, maybe I hasn't been clear… Here's a screenshot, maybe you will understand better.
See, Zig 1 appears as a tab now in the window. So I can trade items which are on my Zig, just like as I already do for those which are on my packer or in my bag.


Q: How many Zigs can a character have, at most?
A:
Currently, 3. And this won't change with the patch.

Q: Couldn't we make the Q50 pants and vest won while playing Wheel of Fortune available to low-level players... through player-to-player exchanges? To achieve that, wouldn't it be enough to have these items stored in our "non-special" bag?
A:
Currently, the refugee armor you get from playing the Wheel is not tradeable... We're thinking about it, but for now I don't have an answer.

Q (Ariald): Okay, if there is nothing else, this summarizes the first patch of January. Ulukyn, do you want to take over briefly to talk about the second one?
A (Ulukyn):
Yes, quickly... The second patch will be for the refactorings, then. They will be patched in January, or in February if everything is not fully tested by then. So I'll make a review.

3 - Silan refactoring

Ulukyn (RT) – 21:51 UTC
I redesigned the tutorial after several opinions from the first testers, and it is now more intuitive and interactive. The feedback about the first two lessons is quite positive. So I'm going to continue and I hope it will really help new players to get their bearings.

I take this opportunity to remind you that the test team is recruiting. So, if you want to test either the patch implementing the additions to the client, or the first lessons of the tutorial, you are welcome.

Q: I can spend some time on the test of the first lessons of the tutorial. How do I sign up?
A:
Just contact Tamarea.

4 - Boss refactoring

Ulukyn (RT) – 22:01 UTC
Boss refactoring will soon be applied all over Atys Atys. However, the work is bound to continue, though we haven't yet determined exactly what we'll be working on. But we'd love to make hunting for Bosses a most funny activity on Ryzom.

One of the ideas that has come up among us, so that players can escape routine and their tactical skills can flourish, is the one of providing each of the current Bosses their own defense mechanics. That's the idea which originated this refactoring project… and gave it its first name: "Boss in the Box".

If you have other ideas, please feel free to post them in the forum under the meeting report.

Any questions ?

Q: "I love you." is the only sentence I can say in a language other than French... Would it be possible for all the faction channels to benefit from automatic translation?
A:
The question is off-topic, but it comes up often enough for us to seriously consider it. However, I cannot give a date for the implementation of this improvement because we need to focus on a small number of projects to be effective.

5 - OP refactoring

Ulukyn (RT) – 22:17 UTC
We have been able to make progress on GvG, but its introduction seems interesting only if accompanied by the planned changes on all Outposts.

That's why we are planning to make several changes at the same time. Namely:
• reducing the duration of battles to one hour (already tested in Nexus);
• rotation of raw materials produced by each outpost every N days (to be determined), via server reboot;
• suppression of the production of Q50 and Q100 materials;
• addition of four outposts in level 50 regions for testing GvG battles.

After that, another patch will implement the last changes, as the project is well advanced thanks to the full-scale tests on the Atys server.

Any questions?

Q: As a result of these changes, Rangers will thus be able to own outposts?
A:
Rangers may already own outposts, but they do not have a generic drill to exploit them. (An off-topic debate ensues between several of the players present, about the Ranger Way).

After a cheerful exchange of congratulations between the RT speakers and the participants, the meeting is closed at 23:00 UTC.

Last edited by Nilstilar (3 years ago) | Reason: FR typos

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#262 Multilingual 

Multilingual | [English] | Français

Ryzom Forge meeting (February 7th 2022)


Date: monday, February 7th, 20:30 UTC (21:30 CET)

Meeting places:
  • Atys, on the public forge channel
or
  • Ryzom Chat, channel #pub-forge-xx (ex https://chat.ryzom.com/channel/pub-forge-en


Duration: 1.5 hour

Participants: all Ryzom players wishing to join.

Nature: informative, questions & answers and feedback meeting.

Topic: Added, in test and ready to be tested projects.
Agenda
  • Next content patch
    • Rywards store
    • RyzHome
    • Wheel of Fortune
    • Ephemeral Enchantments
    • Storyline Content

Last edited by Ghost of Atys (3 years ago)

#263 [en] 

***DEL*** irrelevant.

Last edited by Tykus (3 years ago)

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Kaetemi

#264 [en] 

***DEL*** irrelevant.

Last edited by Tykus (3 years ago)

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Kaetemi
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