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#1 [en] 

(From Sub's thread that I hijacked):

Instead of a once-off that devs or CSRs or whoever has to manually initiate every so often, how about something slightly different. What about an actual end-game activity of battling the Kitin?

Open a new zone only available via speaking with NPCs in capital cities. In this new zone, the Kitin have been building up forces to prepare for an attack. Part of the story could include a surprise counter-assault by the Homins against the Kitin that secures a foothold in the region and closing the gap between there and our current lands.

Part of their preparation was to build, well, grow structures to support them. Structures that players could capture, by defeating guard forces and holding the area for a set time ("King of the hill" kind of game). Any other structure might need to be destroyed to prevent spawning Kitin, or acting in the transportation of Kitin directly into the "base". Defensive fortifications might need to be constructed to help against retaliations. (There would be activities for combat and crafting alike)

Maybe even have new Kitin: Siege Kitin. Huge, powerful, slow-moving beings that could, say, launch spores or a glob of acid or whatever toward a base and damage any fortifications, to weaken it for a Kitin foot-solder attack. If you managed to get caught by the slow-moving attacks of a siege Kitin, it would be a one-shot kill. Maybe devoted followers (Fame 100) of the Kami and Karavan could purchase a one-use siege vehicle using faction points to help assault Kitin bases. Participating in the capture of a base and killing Kitin could reward faction points. Completing missions given by various NPCs in the various camps and bases could also reward faction points.

The Kitin should also play a little smarter. Have the occasional patrols that aren't targeting any specific objective, but also have focused squads that are intended to target specific groups of players. This leads into the possibility of ambush and counter-ambush on both sides.

This is where the "spires" idea could come into play: they're Kitin structures, not Homin structures. Part of the backstory could include Matis research into manipulating the wildlife that allows control over the Kitin spires to benefit players. Capture a base, and after controlling it for a period of time, ALL players in above-ground zones (not in PR zones) begin to benefit from its effects: exp gain increase, crafting success buff, hp/sap/stam/focus max/regen buff, etc. When the base is lost, the buff is gone.

Maybe have a PR zone as well, that only becomes accessible when the entire above-ground zone has been captured. Significantly increased difficulty, and any buffs would apply to players in PR zones and be additional to the above-ground buffs for above-ground zones. Population levels that we have now would mean we don't see the PR zone under assault. Grow the game, see the new region.

Right now, we have nothing to do with all the grinding and grinding that we do. I feel that the cat nerf was sort of a knee-jerk reaction in an attempt to slow down the leveling process to keep people playing longer. Instead, would people play longer if they had something like the Kitin Invasion to fight constantly or whenever they wanted?

#2 [en] 

I like Erizon's idea a lot. However, don't make it an "endgame" thing, make it a major part of the game for all the players.

On one hand, I completely agree. In fact, outpost battles work this way: everyone can contribute in some way, large or small. However, like outpost battles, a max-level opponent would mow down a LOT of people who weren't close to max level without much difficulty.

But then...
It would be nice to actually see Kitins have some kind of agenda (one we could interfere with), instead of just scuttling around aimlessly.

This could be where lower-level players could have more of an impact. The closest thing to what you describe that I've seen in the game so far is the Kitin Patrol. Mostly, they just have a large aggro radius and wander around higher-level PR areas, on patrol.

If, during certain phases of the overall battle, the Kitin had to send out messengers to various other colonies, or perhaps scouts looking for resources or potential victims, they could be level-appropriate for the zone they're in. The NPCs in the capital cities could have a link to the patrol/scout existence, and offer missions to kill them as long as they are still alive. If the Kitin complete their mission, they make gains on the battlefield, maybe receive reinforcements. If you stop them, they don't.

I did intend that the crafting/construction/destruction part be suitable for non-max-level players.

#3 [en] 

(Part 1 of a potential background story):

== The Kitin War: Kitins Advance ==

More than 70 years ago, enraged by a Fyros expedition into the Prime
Roots, the Kitin emerged to swarm the surface of the known homin lands.
Those few homins who were not brutally slaughtered fled into another
region of the Prime Roots, and emerged in a new land.

Hominkind recovered from their refugee flight and established their
presence in these new lands, each race settling in lands similar to
those they left behind. They built forward outposts, and based from
those outposts they tamed the wild new lands and constructed small
villages, towns, and cities.

In reverence to the Kami and the Karavan, and at their request and with
their assistance, homins built magnificent temples to their patron
deities. In short, hominkind had not only recovered from their
devastating losses to the Kitin in the old lands, but they began to
flourish in the new lands.

Inevitably, old feuds began to rise as concerns for every day safety
diminished. Kami followers clashed with Karavan followers.
Civilization clashed with civilization. Scattered small-scale battles
even broke out across the new lands.

That's when the Kitin, biding their time, chose to strike: when homins
were the most comfortable, the most distracted by infighting, and the
least prepared.

After the great swarming, the Kitin did not stop preparing. They were
not satisfied with an overwhelming victory. They knew that if the
homins were able to rebuild their strength, they would lead another
attack on them, just like the Fyros party which attacked them in the

The Kitin colonies have been building forces, and mutating new, powerful
species of warriors. This time, they will not just have another
overwhelming victory.

This time, they will wipe hominkind from the face of Atys.

#4 [en] 

(Part 2 of a potential background story):

== The Kitin War: Homin Preparations ==

Scouts all over Atys have been reporting strange activity surrounding
the Kitin colonies in recent weeks. Kitin messengers have been
traveling between the colonies above ground and in the Roots where they
appear to vanish, perhaps traveling to unknown regions as they go about
their business.

Recently, however, all messenger activity appears to have stopped

One day, a wounded and terrified Tryker rushes into Fairhaven. He
collapses as he reaches the guards, only able to utter the words
"They're coming!" before breathing his last. The news reaches the ears
of the Governor, who sends runners to the other civilizations in an
attempt to find out what is going on.

Upon hearing the news about the Tryker and the Kitin activity, the Zorai
immediately begin to commune with the Kami. In a vision, a Kami appears
to Mabreka Cho, telling him there is a great threat to Atys.

"Danger coming. Those you call Kitin. Come, I show you."

Mabreka Cho awakens and tells his Sages what he has seen. Trusted
messengers are sent to the other civilizations as the Zorai people ready
their magics, regrettably to do what they must do.

The Fyros hear the message and are excited for the coming war, making
ready their newest and most powerful weapons. Songs of war are written,
and sung with exuberance.

The Trykers are worried for their people and their way of life.
Families unite; Kamist and Karavaneer alike work together. Scouting
parties are doubled and tripled. If it is Kitin and it moves, the
Trykers know where it goes, what it eats, and when it sleeps.

The Matis, however, distrust what the Zorai and especially the Kami have
said, and speak with the Karavan emissaries. The warnings are
confirmed, and the Matis reluctantly agree to join the lesser peoples in
preparations for what is coming. They collect the prototypes from their
genetic research and experiments and begin to unveil their secret
weaponry; what was intended for lesser homin will now be used on Kitin.

This time, hominkind has some idea of what to expect from the Kitin;
they will not be surprised a second time. This time, they will not be
caught defenseless. This time, they are united and will take the battle
to the Kitins.

The Kitin menace will finally be put down.

#5 [en] 

(Final part of potential background story):

== The Kitin War: And So It Begins ==

It was the Tryker scouts who first discovered the way. They found the
path that the Kitin had dug in secret which led to a vast new territory.
For the first time, hominkind laid eyes on Kitin structures. Towering
and ominous, they were unlike anything any homin had ever seen before.

But what was most frightening of all were the unknown Kitin species,
present in vast numbers and some as large as a town hall! Homins had to
strike NOW while the Kitin were still mobilizing, or there would be no
chance of survival.

This time, the homins caught the Kitin off-guard. Working together,
they advanced against the Kitin and established a fortification to
protect the new path and their homes and families which lay behind it.

This time, for reasons only known to themselves, the Kami and Karavan
provided protection and even limited assistance to the homins. Still
more distrustful of each other than worried about anything else, the
Kami and the Karavan encamped on opposite sides of the fort from each
other, some distance away. Eerily enough, the Kitin never strayed close
to either camp.

The battle has begun. The Kitin and the Homins are prepared for each
other, and no one is running away this time.

Attention Homins!

We have begun the war for our future, the fight that will determine
whether the Kitin will be broken or whether they swarm the bark of Atys.

We are calling on you, the warriors, the magicians, the healers, the
artisans, to join the battle.

Speak with any recruiter in the capital cities to enlist in the battle,
and meet us on the battlegrounds.

Come and serve your people!

#6 [en] 

Heh, Erizon, your idea sounds almost exactly like what I envisioned once! I even made a basic version of it in the Ring myself, as close as I could get within Ring limitations.

This Ring map has 5 structures held by the Kitin that players can capture by defeating the Kitin guard forces. Capturing these structures prevents the Kitin from spawning nearby. And while held by homins these structures can be used to give benefits to the homin side, like spawning reinforcements to fortify the defense against Kitin retalations. (Because the Kitin will constantly try to get them back, ofcourse.)

I also thought there should be a harvesting and crafting element in addition to just fighting, so the map even has sort of a simulation of harvesting and crafting; at some structures materials can be extracted, which can then be turned in at the workshop to be crafted into weapons to make more soldiers. And ofcourse there are also various NPCs in the various camps giving missions.

(continued in next post)

#7 [en] 

To allow players of all levels to participate, the 5 structures are of climbing difficulty: The first one has level 50 Kitin, the fifth one level 250. And there are Kitin just patrolling the area ofcourse. And one more thing that I included that you didn't mention is that I also had various tribes settle in the region, which could be persuaded to help against the Kitin with the proper diplomacy.

The result was a constantly moving battleground that I thought was awesomely cool.

I hoped to use this Ring map as an example to show to the players how cool this concept could be and to encourage the devs to do pretty much exactly what you're suggesting here: Make a much more bigger and better version for real! And to show that a lot of it can already be done very easily just with the Ring tools!

Unfortunately, because everybody runs the opposite way like a feared raspal when the word "Ring" is so much as mentioned, nobody really paid any attention to my humble effort, so the whole thing got shelved again :/

#8 [en] 

poor relli :o(

arc's kitin fighter was fun at chrimbo. would like to see that built on to star ship troopers proportions, problem with kitin invasions etc is we never have a "fortification" to defend. tatics just become generic :o(


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