Gameplay de recrutement des gardes régionaux - IDEAS FOR RYZOM

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#24 Added by Maxxye 6 years ago [en]

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Jahuu

but if players have to pay for guards, players arent going to like it. If you offer them something for the same content, it might work better.

Players would pay for their protection, for being safe. Why would they not like it ? Of course there could be some rewards too if you invest yourself a bit, why not, good idea there !

Jahuu

Open PvP isnt very good idea imo, there is players who love it and there is others who hate it. Sandbox should work for both (just my opinnion, like everything I write lol). However adding more PvP content is good idea (as long as when I'm tired/afking/digging, I can be just PvE dig, craft and kill myself with gas xD).

Actually, same anwers as before, if you help the land by digging, paying npc patrols, hunting, you would make the land safe and NO PVP ." Power to player" one thing that you will probably not find in another game..

Jahuu

tl;dr Punishing people for not doing PvP isnt making anyone want to do it, encouraging them with reward could.

Already answered at the beginning. And btw, even if ppl won't pay for guards they would probably be safe most of time.. but it would add some content and another way for you guys to get some rewards..

Last edited by Maxxye (6 years ago)

#25 Added by Bitttymacod 6 years ago [en]

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Sinvaders

The idea is not to primilary add PvP content in the game. The idea is to transfer the security of the lands to players.

Well, it certainly sounded that way to me (obviously). I think in part it sounded that way because there is no problem with the "security" of Loria. The Kitins and the beasts therein provide a significant barrier. The Outposts may be fought over, but that is the business of the guilds involved.

Sinvaders

"You would lose most people."
It's exactly because of this mentality that the game is stuck in a status-quo and don't move.

I'm not sure what you mean here. Unless you can show me a massive population of players who would be entranced by a monthly grind to produce resources to "maintain peace" in the outlying areas, then any loss of players is a bad thing.

Sinvaders

" would totally change the nature of the game! "
Maybe collecting mats to fight the goo/build tower defense in Thesos is also against the nature of the game then.

No, it is not, for two reasons:
1. Collection of mats for a limited time to build a single (or even multiple) objects has been an important aspect of the game since before the Temple Wars.
2. Such projects are not a monthly continuing occurrence such as you proposed. They can be done (or not done) and then the event is over.

Sinvaders

You are talking about "dappers" and "short-cycle" as blockers and then it's 'NO'. My opinion is: you read PvP and then you closed the discussion.

You would be wrong. I am against expansion of non-consenual PvP, not against PvP itself (also a long standing part of the game in PR and in OP battles). However, I am also against anything that makes the game more of a grind than it already is, especially accumulation of dappers, which for newbies is very slow. The new people are the ones who need the q100 and q150 areas (they very, very, quickly outgrow the q50 areas because they are staying so long in Silan).

Sinvaders

And maybe instead of opening the zones to PvP, we can think about something based on the same models as patrols in PR, I don't know. Or you can also imagine that, instead of the nation, it's the OP owner which is responsible for the zone etc etc there is many interesting possibilities that can be discussed on this topic.

I agree that the game needs enhanced content, but in my opinion it must be balanced, with reward appropriate to the effort, and within the Lore. If, for instance, there is a sudden resurgence of the Kitins of the Depths in Loria, there needs to be a background reason for them to act that way, and a problem that can be solved to remove the threat. The Kitin Patrols in Prime Roots are there because the Kitins regard the Roots as theirs. They are also the source of continual complaint and irritation because of how they have been implemented, but that is a different conversation.

I note that the Event Team has been working on doing more in terms of events, and that the Marauders have been influencing them (i.e. attacking players when Marauder interests would seem to be threatened, or cooperating with other players when it is to the Marauders advantage). That seems to me to be a good thing.

With respect,
Bitttymacod

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#26 Added by Sinvaders 6 years ago [fr]

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I can't tell you about people leaving the game, but for sure the fact that the game is stuck doesn't attracted new players and players who might return if things are moving on. And some are leaving or leaved because the game is/was going to nowhere.

But I think, we kinda have the same understanding on severals points here.

I agreed on that:

- PvP shouldn't be forced, that's why in this proposal we included a way to bypass this by paying for players. But maybe in the proposal, it's a bit too much and in a too short period of time;

- We suggested a paid in mats/dappers exactly because it has already be done in the past and it will continue to be done (goo, thesos tower defense, temple war etc) and it's a good way to make homin responsible of what they do in a certain basis;

- I'm glad that I was wrong with this sentence : "You are talking about "dappers" and "short-cycle" as blockers and then it's 'NO'. My opinion is: you read PvP and then you closed the discussion." :)
The grind aspect is something that we need to take into account but right now I don't see any others solutions than more grinds in a first time :/ but maybe it can be an long event where cities/nations could train and help by collecting mats the new patrols to watch the land instead of collecting mats every N days;

- Collecting dappers is hard because the economy is broken. As a marauder player for me it's impossible to grind dappers if I want to play my char on the right way: aka to collect dappers you need to do mission or occupations:
- craft mission are given by PNJ's who increase our fame at one point and/or are friends with nations... doesn't make sense for me to do that;
- occupation: as far as I know I can't do them since I'm not allowed in any city of Atys (because of my fame being lower than -50 everywhere);

But maybe we can link the craft mission with the proposal we have here... like that people continue to grind but help at the same time (means rewards as its already in place).

What made me mad recently is the federals guard who appeared on Fairhaven... but understand me, I'm not against those guards they are more than welcome in my opinion but the point is how it has been done: --> Players requested them on Taliari assembly and then guards popped (request was to eject marauders), and they made this request because they were not able to eject us themselves (yeah they never tag... so how do you want to eject your ennemies from the city in that case)... its just doesn't sound fair cause guards are over powered and we can't do anything about. To me if players doesn't want to see us: 1) they tag and say us good bye with their axes. 2) they help to increase the guards patrol. And then the proposal has nothing to do with PvP really, it's adding PvE and interactions in the game.

For the event team, you are right they are trying to include us in some events (and not only PvP events in case you mind (yeah I'm not an hardcore PvP player at all and I'm bad at it to be honest)). And we have our roles to play (and sometimes my char is feeling hurt as a marauder when his ennemies are healing him for whatever reasons). But yes, it's a very good thing and I hope that others we learn how to play with us in a respectful way (both last events which has been player with marauders interaction where a success for both side).

#27 Added by Moniq 6 years ago [en]

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Sinvaders

...As a marauder player for me it's impossible to grind dappers if I want to play my char on the right way: aka to collect dappers you need to do mission or occupations:
- craft mission are given by PNJ's who increase our fame at one point and/or are friends with nations... doesn't make sense for me to do that;
- occupation: as far as I know I can't do them since I'm not allowed in any city of Atys (because of my fame being lower than -50 everywhere);

I hope there will be some changes once the real marauder fame arrive. I have been thinking about that, it might be possible that (once marauders will be "real faction") some of tribes will turn back to their religions and change allegiance to marauders.
I have no closer idea what all will the marauder fame really bring, but seems logical to me that they should have some "support" as kami and kara have. Maybe not that big for their matter. And there I see space for pro-marauder missions.

About payed guards, well, it lookes like not any bad idea that there will be a mechanism where guilds/players can "pay" for (more) guards up to some reasonable limit and for some limited time. I also don't like that those federal guards appeared magically one day from nowhere. I think it had to be connected, at least, to (series of) event(s) like building feds base camp or "guild hall" and crafting equipment etc...

Last edited by Moniq (6 years ago) | Reason: +about guards

#28 Added by Zagh 6 years ago [fr]

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Azazor

Tout ceux qui ont répondu ici sont full tag pvp.

Faux ! Je ne tag plus depuis un bon moment. Je n'ai jamais été un fervent supporter du PvP (même en étant Alkiane et oui).

Et je supporte à fond l'idée d'entretenir la sécurité des territoires de chaque peuple... pourquoi ? Justement parce qu'un territoire ça s'entretient et ça se défend pour assurer sa sécurité.

Pourquoi bis ? Parce que j'ai toujours eu envie de voir en entrant dans une région qu'elle appartenait à "quelqu'un" via le fameux message info système. En l'occurrence ça pourrait être "La zone est défendue par le Royaume / l'Empire / la Théocratie / la Fédération" ou "La zone n'est sous le contrôle de personne, les bandits grouillent".

On est dans un jeu où un gameplay a été conçu en relation avec un background fait de relation positive et négative entre les différents peuples et foi. Je pense qu'il serait temps d'assumer ceci. Il y a des affinités et des velléités entre les peuples qu'il faut assumer et exploiter.

Au même titre que les postes avancés pour les kitins que certains alimentent toujours alors qu'il n'y a pas d'invasion, voyez cette proposition de défendre vos territoires d'un ennemi, le maraudeur, qui en veut aux civilisations et à leurs membres. Assurez la sécurité de vos territoire pour vous garantir la paix, comme avec les kitins.

Last edited by Vauban (6 years ago)

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Vauban

#29 Added by Kimyh 6 years ago [fr]

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Et si on faisait l'inverse ?
Devoir payer pour rendre une zone pvp ?

#30 Added by Sinvaders 6 years ago [fr]

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Et tu justifierais comment le fait que l'on paye pour que la zone devienne PvP?

+1000 Zagh

#31 Added by Bitttymacod 6 years ago [en]

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Bribe fund to make the guards look the other way.?

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#32 Added by Sinvaders 6 years ago [fr]

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Does it makes sense to pay some bribes to the guards?
Not sure if any nations will accept to have corrupted guards. Or if the guards die the zone become PvP... but in that case you can be sure that some zone will always be in PvP mode and this is not what you want, right?

Or zone protected by default and players can increase the guards and if guards died then PvP mode in the zone. But this is really far away from the initial proposal goal (cause the goal is not to put the game in PvP mode otherwise we would have ask for full tag).

#33 Added by Bitttymacod 6 years ago [en]

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I was simply offering an idea to justify the concept. I didn't claim it was a "good idea".

((As for bribes... there are always corrupt homins.))

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#34 Added by Sinvaders 6 years ago [fr]

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No problem, I was just explaining why I think Kimyh's proposal is not a good idea. And why bribes will not match RP players will and will mess up the actual GP but maybe I am wrong.

#35 Added by Azazor 6 years ago [fr]

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Qu'est ce qui déplait dans l'idée de simplement payer non pas pour avoir une protection contre le pvp mais juste plus de gardes dans la cité (en laissant le pvp optionnel). ça reste logique dans l'optique RP (on paie pour avoir plus de garde), tout en laissant tranquille ceux qui ne veulent jamais pvp (sans avoir à payer pour ça) et qui en plus se foutent du rp (car ceux qui n'aiment pas pvp mais qui sont rp je pense pas que ça les dérangera, vu que cette proposition de syron rajoute du rp).

En gros, faut pouvoir contenter:

les pvp/rp
les rp
les non pvp/non rp (chose que ne permet pas la proposition originale).

(et les pvp/non rp à la rigueur)

PS: après j'avoue me faire l'avocat du diable. Je serai ravis si cette proposition était mise en place.

Edited 2 times | Last edited by Azazor (6 years ago)

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#36 Added by Jazzy 6 years ago [fr]

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hm... question peut etre bete mais...
si, au lieu d'obliger le pvp (meme si l'idée de fond me plait assez) on donnerai des recompenses aux pvpistes, je parle d'autres recompenses que celles qui existent deja (robes, boubou, cristaux) je ne sais pas, un casque marau boost, ou une pique Vedice+tekorn, ou des items d'op, je dis des idées en vrac (ne me tapez pas, je dis au pif ^^).
sur fond d'event pvp, je pense que chacun s'y remettrait, les joueurs ont besoin d'un event pour jouer le jeu! sinon ils s'enracine dans un confort quotidien. mais si, à la clés d'un certain score pvp, ils peuvent aller ouvrir un coffre caché je ne sais où... et recupérer "une récompense" je pense qu'il y aurait + de pvp...

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#37 Added by Maxxye 6 years ago [fr]

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Faudrait lancer un autre sujet pour ça alors Jazzou ^^

#38 Added by Moniq 6 years ago [en]

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Jazzy

hm... question peut etre bete mais...
si, au lieu d'obliger le pvp (meme si l'idée de fond me plait assez) on donnerai des recompenses aux pvpistes, je parle d'autres recompenses que celles qui existent deja (robes, boubou, cristaux) je ne sais pas, un casque marau boost, ou une pique Vedice+tekorn, ou des items d'op, je dis des idées en vrac (ne me tapez pas, je dis au pif ^^).
sur fond d'event pvp, je pense que chacun s'y remettrait, les joueurs ont besoin d'un event pour jouer le jeu! sinon ils s'enracine dans un confort quotidien. mais si, à la clés d'un certain score pvp, ils peuvent aller ouvrir un coffre caché je ne sais où... et recupérer "une récompense" je pense qu'il y aurait + de pvp...

Do I understand it right - more rewards for more pvp kills? I am just asking, because time to time some cowards harvest free pvp points on killing me. Best from behind while unarmed and afk :P I dont see any reason to get anything for that.

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